Techniques: Metal lure or tins:

[surfstix1963]

All of my metals for the surf I like them to be 2-3 oz.The two I most often use are Hopkins and Kastmaster I feel they cover the bases.

Hopkins:Made of Stainless steel, virtually indestructive they come in 3 types the No=eql the shorty and the smoothie & they catch everything.I like the hammered finish & single dressed hook on these I think the hook up rate is better than the short treble they come with.I also like my fingers if I don't have to mess w/ a treble I won't.

Fishing them:I don't think you can fish these wrong.Cast them out let them drop and start your retrieve or bounce them across the bottom or you can even skip them across the top.They seem to have the same action regardless of the retrieve unless you are skipping it they will just rise up in the water column if the speed is faster.

Kastmaster:Made of brass very durable they have a crazy wobble or sway to them, these are better retrieved at a slower rate therefore mid to lower water column same thing cast out let them sink and start your retrieve.

Crippled herring and shad types: Basically the same retrieve style just keep it moving.Gotta tell you I have not had all that much success w/these if its a bluefish blitz you will catch, the schoolies seem to like them in the wash I feel they are better suited for jigging.

Diamond jigs:I do use the tube tails(green and white seem to work) if the sandeels are around I usually just cast hit bottom and kind of hop them across the bottom with pauses or just a very slow retrieve w/ twitches now and then.This is another lure I feel is better suited for sqidding or vertical jigging rips.

Deadly *****:These come in 3 styles also the standard(much like a kastmaster)The long casting (which is much skinnier and longer)and new to the lineup is the DD diamond jig(which is the std. w/a 6 sided edge put on it)the largest wt. is 1 oz. so from a jig standpoint or my view useless for what I do.

The best of the bunch is the long casting version especially in the smaller sizes for the albies(the retrieve is to smoke it fast for them) & the larger sizes are a good imitator for sandeels or worms.(fished much like the diamond jig but just a little off the bottom so it retains its wiggle.

These are a few of the basics like any other thing there is a ton of knockoffs.

[cowherder]

.

Hopkins:Made of Stainless steel, virtually indestructive they come in 3 types the No=eql the shorty and the smoothie & they catch everything.I like the hammered finish & single dressed hook on these I think the hook up rate is better than the short treble they come with.I also like my fingers if I don't have to mess w/ a treble I won't.



I never thought of taking the treble off and replacing it with a single hook. When you say dressed hook you are talking about a teaser on it? Or taking the treble off and replacing it with a single hook teaser. Very good to know, thanks for sharing.

[surfstix1963]

I never thought of taking the treble off and replacing it with a single hook. When you say dressed hook you are talking about a teaser on it? Or taking the treble off and replacing it with a single hook teaser. Very good to know, thanks for sharing.

Take the trebel off and replace it with single hook teaser depending on the weight of the lure. I use 2 & 3 oz. so I replace them with usually 5/0 VMC or when the gorillas are around I'll even use a 6/0 you really can't hurt a metals action too much unlike other plugs which could be thrown off by larger hooks.

[cowherder]

thanks, surfstix!

[finchaser]

I never thought of taking the treble off and replacing it with a single hook. When you say dressed hook you are talking about a teaser on it? Or taking the treble off and replacing it with a single hook teaser. Very good to know, thanks for sharing.


Hopkins come with a single SS dressed hook also

[surfstix1963]

Yes and you can also get them with a surgical tube.I think these lures come w/ some of the best hooks in the business they very seldom bend or straighten out.I tie my own because I like to carry a couple of different colors with me and just change out the tailhook.

[DarkSkies]

Take the trebel off and replace it with single hook teaser depending on the weight of the lure. I use 2 & 3 oz. so I replace them with usually 5/0 VMC or when the gorillas are around I'll even use a 6/0 you really can't hurt a metals action too much unlike other plugs which could be thrown off by larger hooks.

I just wanted to add a few thoughts to these posts. (btw great thread, Surfstix. :thumbsup: )

When the big bluefish are around you don't want to spend a lot of time ripping treble hooks out of their mouths because you lose fishin time. That great action going on in front of you could be over in 5 minutes, or 5 hours.

Before going after the bigger blues the other day I swapped out some hooks for some larger ones. I know I could have used ones better suited for the metal size, but these were the ones I had handy at that moment and I had to get it done and get out there.

As the bigger blues leave, the ones I don't lose I'll swap out the hooks again for more average sized ones like the 5/0s Surfstix was talking about.

Just thought people might want to see a pic of metals that have been working. BTW yesterday, the Ava jig with white or green tube was crushing the blues at the 3rd spot we moved to, whereas at another spot it was all about a wider profile spoon or metal, like gator, kroc, or kastmaster.

10896


I have also been swapping out the cheap split rings with Wolverine HD split rings. All you have to do is lose one big fish due to a crappy split ring before you realize how important they are.

[DarkSkies]

Yes and you can also get them with a surgical tube.I think these lures come w/ some of the best hooks in the business they very seldom bend or straighten out.I tie my own because I like to carry a couple of different colors with me and just change out the tailhook.

I'm also now buying hooks with surgical tubes by the 10-pk and swapping out some of my more worn tubes with these new ones. I tend to buy the larger ones as I feel they offer more action.

One of the tiimes this could work against you is when small bait is around and albies are around. In that case a big tail makes too long of a profile. These are all things a good fisherman thinks about. :learn:

[fishinmission78]

When the big bluefish are around you don't want to spend a lot of time ripping treble hooks out of their mouths because you lose fishin time. That great action going on in front of you could be over in 5 minutes, or 5 hours.


Yup yup, and don't fish teasers when the big blues are around. I can't understand why guys would do that this time of year. Wait till they leave and you can target bass. What's the use of having two 12lb blues on at the same time, it's shear insanity.

[CharlieTuna]

I just saw this when browsing the surf threads. Very informative and helpful, thanks for sharing.
One thing I would add is when large sand eels are around, you can add a tube or rubber sand eel to the single hook to give it a longer profile. Sometimes this is the difference between catching and not catching.

[nitestrikes]

As the water gets colder, I slow down the retrieve of the tins. Or, I keep it steady, and then periodically jig it up and down like a dying baitfish. This is easier to do from a boat, but if you practice enough in the surf you will get the hang of it. A slight difference in retrieve can get you more fish. You just have to experiment to see what works for that time and place.

[albiealert]

^ That's very detailed advice surfstix. Great thread and advice guys! I like the erratic retrieve when I am not catching as well. You have to keep experimenting until you find something that works.

[fishinmission78]

I think someone mentioned it already, but you can play around with the retrieval speed. Fish have different behavior. One day they want you to burn it past them, even if the water is cold. Generally, as the water temps drop I try to slow my retrieve down a bit.

[crosseyedbass]

One day they want you to burn it past them, even if the water is cold.

Today they wanted you do do that. I also jigged up and down a little with my retrieve. Got 8 bass and lost a lot more, it was fantastic fishing.:cool:

[storminsteve]

A lot of good advice here. I think the consensus is to give the fish what they want. Don't get pushed into thinking inside the box. As the water is cold you may have to slow it down, but as I read here, there are times when you have to tease the fish. Burn it past them so they are forced to react, and then pause if you are getting short hits.

[DarkSkies]

A lot of good advice here. I think the consensus is to give the fish what they want. Don't get pushed into thinking inside the box. As the water is cold you may have to slow it down, but as I read here, there are times when you have to tease the fish. Burn it past them so they are forced to react, and then pause if you are getting short hits.







These are some thoughts I had today and thought I would share them...

some of ya's know Ron Muccie, hopefully. :thumbsup:
He's about as old-school as you can get. He doesn't fish as much as he used to, but when he gets out there he and his group usually out-fish the guys around them, at times 2:1 or better, when the fall metal bite is in full swing.
A lot of that is technique, but he fishes tin squids and teasers as well. There are times that these tin squids will outfish every other profile guys are throwing. I have found those to be when the action slows, or the water is cloudier, or the fish are just picky that day....yes, even in fall during good feediing conditions, this is bound to happen....




The castmaster, along with the Hopkins are 2 metals no serious surfcaster should ever be without. IMO the Hopkins transcends the "fall only" thinking and should be something always in the bag of the serious surfcaster.

Anyone can catch a fish when they're there in numbers.
Carrying different metals allows you to fine tune your presentation to more closely match what the fish are feeding on.

there are times when they are just not feeding on big forage, or the forage represented by the metal profile you are throwing.
Last year at IBSP a guy got a 44# bass on a metal and teaser combo.
Food for thought, guys












**********
^^Good post Steve.
Thanks to Surfstix, you, and others for explaining the nuances of fishing metal....it's not just about the cast and retrieve....the guys who out catch others are definitely doing things differently....:learn:

Feel free to add to this thread....almost time to fish metal from the beaches....:fishing:

[DarkSkies]

Someone elsewhere mentioned that the T-Hex was the only thing he ever fished when the metal bite was on, period. :huh:
I think that was being short-sighted and limiting his fishing....
Here are some thoughts I had, feel free to add yours.....




There is something to be said for not complicating your surf bag...carrying lots of jigs adds to the weight and fatigue....I get that....

When there is a true "metal bite" a lot of us switch bags to a smaller one that will carry metals and one or 2 small plugs.....

If you can't do that, you can take your regular bag, and purge it of most things that will not be related to that type of forage and fishing,,,,that will cut the weight right there.....












.......But to say that you only carry t-hex...(although Steve is a great guy and those metals are great)...:thumbsup:...

That thinking really does limit your catching....

You will catch when the action is hot, as anyone else will...but what happens when that action does down, guys go home because they think it's over....yet there are still fish to be caught, if they would just change their thinking....

there have been days that only a yellow teaser gets fish...
Or, when talking avas and tails, that a green, yellow, black, or white tube is the one that will out-produce all the others combined.. (talking about daytime fishing here).....

.I don't live close to some of the action...If I spend the gas to drive down to fish I'm not going home till I'm sure there isn't one single fish left in the area I'm in, or that I have exhausted all possibilities...at that point, is when I feel like I have given it my best and will finally concede....


Just something to think about, that's all..
:HappyWave:

[DarkSkies]

Look at the old-timers....

If you're ever lucky enough to fish with the OGB Finchaser, you will see he imparts different action to his retrieves.....
these things are important enough that sometimes he will outfish others on the beach by more than a 2:1 margin....

Some other old-timers that will crush all competition, because of their attention to detail are guys like the Old Farts Fishing Club, Bucktail Willie, and dozens of guys their age who don't have an internet presence, facebook page, etc...they just go out and get it done, time after time..


Should you run into someone like this one day, and he's bailing fish after fish....pay attention...ya just might pick up some tips....:learn:

[lostatsea]

Look at the old-timers....

If you're ever lucky enough to fish with the OGB Finchaser, you will see he imparts different action to his retrieves.....
these things are important enough that sometimes he will outfish others on the beach by more than a 2:1 margin....

Some other old-timers that will crush all competition, because of their attention to detail are guys like the Old Farts Fishing Club, Bucktail Willie, and dozens of guys their age who don't have an internet presence, facebook page, etc...they just go out and get it done, time after time..
Should you run into someone like this one day, and he's bailing fish after fish....pay attention...ya just might pick up some tips....:learn:

I was on the beach the other day and there was this one old timer that was catching blues at a rate way higher than the rest. It seemed like every few casts he was hooked up. I paid attention like you said and saw that he was getting out farther than the rest of us. He was also tritching his metal while the rest of us were going for a steady retrieve. I was always told to reel fast for the blues. This time that didn't work. Crazy stuff these blues were hard to catch! Glad that I managed to get 3 of them but it was tough.

[Monty]

Will be trying out these the next couple of trips.
I have not used metal exactly like this before.
I met Ron of Jersey Ghost Tackle the other morning and he was very generous and gave me a few to try out.

http://rocksimpson.com/images/2013_5_30_Jersey_Ghost_White.jpg


http://rocksimpson.com/images/2013_5_30_Jersey_Ghost_Chart.jpg


http://rocksimpson.com/images/2013_6_2_BF_Ghost.jpg

[storminsteve]

Nice looking metals. Who made those teasers?

[Monty]

Nice looking metals. Who made those teasers?

I am thinking Ron Of Jersey Ghost, they were on the lures when he gave them to me.

[DarkSkies]

Someone elsewhere mentioned that the T-Hex was the only thing he ever fished when the metal bite was on, period. :huh:
I think that was being short-sighted and limiting his fishing....



Here are some thoughts I had, feel free to add yours.....




.I don't live close to some of the action...If I spend the gas to drive down to fish I'm not going home till I'm sure there isn't one single fish left in the area I'm in, or that I have exhausted all possibilities...at that point, is when I feel like I have given it my best and will finally concede....


Just something to think about, that's all..
:HappyWave:

I was going to go into more detail about some of these posts as they apply to the 2013 bluefish bite.
As the water (generally) has been colder this Spring than usual, these bluefish, in my experience, have been somewhat sluggish.

Coupled with the fact that in most instances, the smaller bluefish can't feed on the bunker, and only have one or two kinds of bait (all small) to choose from, the bite has been very specific at times.....

I am now carrying about 7 different kinds and sizes of metals with me...

The bite has been so specific, for me, that in the beginning if I didn't have the right metal I would see others out-catch me at least by a 2:1 margin.....after getting schooled so many times I changed things and started carrying more metal......

[DarkSkies]

I don't have as much time anymore for these page-long posts.
Some of ya's are probably very happy to hear that....:moon: :laugh:


Before I post my thoughts, I figured I would ask you folks out there...
(Thanks to Surfstix for starting this thread, BTW....:HappyWave:)





1.What are you now doing differently with metals or tins, to catch these picky bluefish that some of us have been seeing?
2. How and Why do you decide to change a style of metal, so that your catch rate goes up?

[surfstix1963]

Sometimes I just change the tailhook color or size of the tin,naturally different retrieve speeds or a slow bounce off the bottom general idea is to make it appear as a worm taking off this is done at a snails pace with gentle lifts of your rod in between slow cranks of the reel.

[storminsteve]

I2. How and Why do you decide to change a style of metal, so that your catch rate goes up?

Dark, I have noticed that for the last few weeks the rainfish have been getting thicker. Normally around this time of year I see different kinds but it seems the rainfish are dominating where I am fishing. So I have downsized my metals and have gotten blues pretty much every time out there. Hey they are only small blues but at least they are something. I am using an ava 007 with redgill teaser. What are you guys using to score?

[seamonkey]

I want to thank you for this thread. Came up to nnj to fish for bluefish today and got 10 but missed about 310.:mad: I always thought they would be more insane or aggressive in the spring. If any one has any other tips for tossing metal in the spring I would appreciate it. thanks

[J Barbosa]

I want to thank you for this thread. Came up to nnj to fish for bluefish today and got 10 but missed about 310.:mad: I always thought they would be more insane or aggressive in the spring. If any one has any other tips for tossing metal in the spring I would appreciate it. thanks

They are still lethargic from the colder water temps. Even during the hot action periods I haven't been able to raise one on top water. Throw a swimmer, bucktail or metal and get one the next cast.

Bluefish have a reputation of being aggressive and hitting anything that moves but that's not always true in the spring although most guys won't admit to having a hard time catching bluefish. Lol

The guys who caught the most today and Saturday were all fishing the bottom water column. Bucktail or Ava's fished deep and retrieved quickly.
A week of sunny days and we should have all the popper and spook action we want :dribble:

I see in the other thread you suffered from cut offs. I caught about 50 - 75 bluefish since last Thursday and only had one cut off. I use 4-5ft of 50lb mono leader (60 - 80lb preferred I just ran out).

Avoid using small plugs like mag darters as a big 10-15lb blue can inhale the whole thing and cut you off. Same can be said for buck tails even though they are deadly on bluefish.

If you are getting that many missed hits and cut offs the first thing I would try is speeding up your retrieve. Allow your jig to sink and use the right weight for the water depth and current.