Gateway National Recreational Areas, what would you do if they shut them down?

[basshunter]

I read about the possibility of them shutting them down, at Sandy Hook, Great Kills, and Jamaica Bay. Would you get involved in a protest? Personally I don't think it will happen, but was asking myself how crowded it could get at other areas, like Island beach, if it did.

[storminsteve]

I don't think it will happen either. I think it is just a way to get people nervous, like they did a bunch of years ago. Honestly, with all the budget crises we are having in this state, I think the state parks have a better chance of getting shut down sooner, like they did a few short years ago. If they did shut the parks like Sandy Hook down, I would definitely be in line to protest!:lynchmob:

[plugcrazy]

island beach and the other beaches would be wall to wall people if this happened. They definitely better not shut it down or it would ruin the fishing at other places.

[finchaser]

oh well another accomplishment by Nobama

[ledhead36]

I think they talk about shutting it down as a ploy, as was mentioned. I did read in one of the posts on here that Sandy Hook is having financial trouble.
http://stripersandanglers.com/Forum/showthread.php?2467-Sandy-Hook-how-much-would-you-pay&highlight=sandy+hook+pay

My .02 - for the yearly enjoyment we get out of that place I think the user fees could be higher. It's a good resource and I would hate to have access restricted. Same for Great Kills, which I have fished a few times. Beautiful unspoiled places for the most part, except for when the crowds come. I wouldn't mind forking over a few more dollars to keep them clean and running efficiently.

[finchaser]

It's on Nobama's list of places to close to fishing only

[ledhead36]

Yeah but do you really think it will happen? I know dozens of guys who would be protesting at the entrance if that ever happened. I remember the things said on here about mpas, and I believe it's possible. If they were to ever close an institution like Sandy Hook, I don't think people would just take it willingly. jmo

[finchaser]

Yes my neighbor works there and rumor has it they are loosing money and it could be shut for good,really has nothing to do with shut down of government. In California they shut down 250 miles of beach to fishing. If my memory serves me right there are 40 National parks including 3 on Long Island that are on the Obama shut down down list. sandy hook is on the list which Obama resurrected when he took office.

[stripermania]

The Jersey shore is known for its fishing. I would think that Sandy Hook would be overrun with fishermen if they ever tried to close it down.

[jigfreak]

would be overrun with fishermen if they ever tried to close it down.

Or they would all drift on down to ibsp.

[baitstealer]

How about that? I guess they need the money.


Date: March 12, 2012
Contact: John Harlan Warren (http://www.nps.gov/PWR/sendmail.htm?o=388K3M%3A%2BDKJZ%26OAV%2F%5DP%3EXXT %2624%20%20%20%0A&r=/gate/parknews/parking-fee-increase-2012.htm), 718-354-4608


Parking fees at two areas within Gateway National Recreation Area will increase beginning this summer. The increases have been approved by National Park Service Director Jon Jarvis, following a public comment period last summer and fall.
"The public spoke and Gateway listened," said Superintendent Linda Canzanelli. The parking fee increases at Sandy Hook in Monmouth County, New Jersey are half of what was originally proposed last summer. "These modest fee increases will help the park maintain visitor services while keeping outdoor recreation affordable for working families. A season pass costs about the same as a night at the movies for a family of four, but it buys you a whole summer of fun at the beach."
Daily parking fees at the beach areas of Gateway's Sandy Hook Unit will increase from $10 per vehicle to $15 per vehicle. Vehicles over 20' in length will pay $30. Season parking passes will increase from $50 to $75 per vehicle, while oversized vehicle passes will now cost $150. Fees will be charged until 5 P.M. This is the first parking fee increase at Sandy Hook since 2001 and the fourth since parking fees were first established by Gateway in 1983.
At Jacob Riis Park in Queens, daily parking fees will increase from $5 to $10, with oversized vehicles to be charged $20 per day. Season parking passes will now cost $65 for most vehicles and $130 for oversized vehicles. Fees will be charged until 6 P.M. This is the first parking fee increase at Jacob Riis Park since 2004.

The new parking fees compare favorably with state and local beaches near both Sandy Hook (http://www.nps.gov/gate/parkmgmt/upload/RFD-Comparibility.pdf) and Jacob Riis Park (http://www.nps.gov/gate/parkmgmt/upload/compatability-for-fee-increase-JB-2011.pdf), where the charge is usually per person rather than per vehicle. As in the past, daily parking passes will be good for the day of purchase only.
Since this is a parking fee rather than an entrance fee, it is still free of charge to visit non-beach areas. This includes access to the Sandy Hook Lighthouse and Fort Hancock, Floyd Bennett Field in Brooklyn, Fort Wadsworth in Staten Island and Jamaica Bay Wildlife Refuge in Queens. Holders of the federal Senior Pass or Access Pass receive a 50% discount on parking fees.

Parking fees collected by Gateway have paid for hundreds of improvement projects at Sandy Hook, Jacob Riis Park and areas throughout Gateway. Here is a sample. (http://www.nps.gov/gate/parkmgmt/upload/recfee_photos.pdf)

Operations: Lifeguards, visitor protection, maintenance of visitor facilities.
Expanding the docking facility at Sandy Hook.
Rehabilitation of campgrounds at Floyd Bennett Field.
Shoreline monitoring at Sandy Hook.
Rehabilitation of the Ryan Visitor Center at Floyd Bennett Field.
Paving the Multi-Use Path at Sandy Hook.
Repairing the Boardwalk railing at Jacob Riis Park.
Sand Slurry beach replenishment at Sandy Hook.
Kayaking and sailing public programs.
Rehabilitation of Frank Charles Park in Queens.
Season parking passes will be available for purchase at Sandy Hook beginning Monday, April 16 and atJacob Riis Park beginning the weekend before Memorial Day.
About Gateway National Recreation Area
Established in 1972, Gateway National Recreation Area offers more than 26,000 acres of marshes, wildlife sanctuaries and recreational athletic facilities, miles of sandy beaches; indoor and outdoor classrooms; picnicking and camping areas, as well as historic structures and military installations, airfields, a lighthouse, and adjacent waters around New York harbor. The park offers urban residents in two states a wide range of recreational opportunities year round. With more than nine million visitors a year, it is the third most visited national park in the country. For information about Gateway's upcoming public programs, see the park's Web site at http://www.nps.gov/gate/index.htm.

[hookset]

That doesn't bother me I hardly ever fish the day. Too much traffic anyway.

[finchaser]

now we will see how many mexicans yuo can really fit in a van

[cowherder]

Has anyone noticed there are less fishermen at the hook since last Fall?

[DarkSkies]

^ Cowherder, someone is paying attention.:HappyWave:
Thanks for mentioning that......I was recently told that Night Fishing pass purchases have dropped 30% over the last 3 years. Even accounting for Sandy, that's a pretty substantial drop.....

I don't know how many folks out there realize they are struggling managing to staff the park faced with declining revenues....
I know some get upset about the subject as they remember a time when Sandy Hook fishing at night was free.....

But in this challenging economy....


Daily parking fees at the beach areas of Gateway's Sandy Hook Unit will increase from $10 per vehicle to $15 per vehicle. Vehicles over 20' in length will pay $30. Season parking passes will increase from $50 to $75 per vehicle, while oversized vehicle passes will now cost $150. Fees will be charged until 5 P.M. This is the first parking fee increase at Sandy Hook since 2001 and the fourth since parking fees were first established by Gateway in 1983.

I was wondering if any here had any thoughts or suggestions for increasing revenue there and ensuring the future?
(Again, please don't quote me on this....these stats are not published anywhere)....I can't verify.....just some worried talk from some of the folks I know......








My main thoughts and questions......
1. What would you be willing to do...to see Sandy Hook stay open and operate profitably...and not be parceled out to the private sector?
(Remember the ill-fated developments in 2008-09)
2. How much more would you be willing to pay to help with Sandy Hook's operating costs?
(bearing in mind that a yearly night fishing pass for IBSP is $200)

[J Barbosa]

They are not getting any substantial revenue from night time fisherman.

Even if they sold 1,000 passes every year (doubt it) that is only $50,000. Barely enough to cover one ranger's lousy salary and benefits. There is usually two guys in the ranger shack every night plus one car out on patrol.

Don't forget that that NPS is a federally funded program and our tax dollars go into buying and preserving the land for that program.

It is rediculous to charge us for something we already paid for...YOUR TAX DOLLARS AT WORK!!!

They make money with the beach goers...every parking lot is full on the weekends and there is usually a waiting line to get into the park by 2-3pm. $15/day or $75 yearly probably make more in one day then they do all year with fisherman.

[DarkSkies]

1. Even if they sold 1,000 passes every year (doubt it) that is only $50,000. Barely enough to cover one ranger's lousy salary and benefits. There is usually two guys in the ranger shack every night plus one car out on patrol.


2. It is rediculous to charge us for something we already paid for...YOUR TAX DOLLARS AT WORK!!!

.



You make some good points here, John...thanks for making them. :thumbsup:

1. I don't know the exact salary for Rangers, just some feedback from some of my contacts. Some further info to think about....
Most of the Park Rangers and toll collectors are seasonal, and seasonal Ranger pay is not too much higher than some armed security guards are paid. There are few benefit packages in addition to salary for seasonal workers. Some take that job to gain resume experience and possible "in" to the federal employee system or other LE jobs.

Would anyone be surprised to know that 50k might be a little less than the combined salary of 2 full time rangers?
Or enough to pay 3-4 part time Rangers?
Some of the Rangers manage to make more with OT, as there are seasonal surges in various Coastal Federal parks....
A. What if the night passes sold each year were 2000 x 100?...a $50 fee increase....then the numbers become more interesting......:learn:
B. What if they increased the day rates another 25% with discounts for buying season passes? You and others touched on the strong demand, with parking lots being full during the summer.



2. Charging us for something we have already paid for.....Many have made that same comment.....
Island Beach is a state park........Couldn't one make the argument that because we pay state and muni taxes....(some of us pay a lot if you own a house)....that parks like IBSP it should be free or reduced fees to state residents........ with higher fees to out-of-staters?
(I believe that's how they address beach access in some other states....)









Just figured I would give you people some more things to think about, and continue the dialogue here....
Any other realistic ideas for increasing revenue?
Thanks. :HappyWave:

[clamchucker]

Dark I remember when there were no fees to fish the park at night. I haven't fished up there in years. When I was younger I would travel a lot and to Hatteras every year. Things change and it costs money to run parks. One thing for Vets to be aware of is that you used to get in free if you were a Vet. I think at all state and federal parks it is a good policy to give discounts to Vets or Seniors. We are living on a reduced income and that would be fair.

[hookedonbass]

The parking fee increases at Sandy Hook in Monmouth County, New Jersey are half of what was originally proposed last summer. "These modest fee increases will help the park maintain visitor services while keeping outdoor recreation affordable for working families. A season pass costs about the same as a night at the movies for a family of four, but it buys you a whole summer of fun at the beach."
Daily parking fees at the beach areas of Gateway's Sandy Hook Unit will increase from $10 per vehicle to $15 per vehicle. This is the first parking fee increase at Sandy Hook since 2001 and the fourth since parking fees were first established by Gateway in 1983.




They make money with the beach goers...every parking lot is full on the weekends and there is usually a waiting line to get into the park by 2-3pm. $15/day or $75 yearly probably make more in one day then they do all year with fisherman.

They are only charging $15/car. If you want to go to one of the beaches in monmouth or ocean it's like 10 per person. If you're bringing a carload of kids on a hot summer day it's still a great deal. They should charge $20/car if they need more $$. Also like the idea with the resident vs nonresident pricing.

[hookedonbass]

Parking fees going up.
http://www.nps.gov/gate/parkmgmt/parking-fee-increase.htm

[hookedonbass]

This is a follow up to the above article


MaryAnn Spoto
on December 06, 2014 at 1:08 PM, updated December 06, 2014 at 1:09 PM



SANDY HOOK — Proposed parking and camping fee hikes at Sandy Hook will be the subject of a public hearing next month, National Park Service officials announced.

As well as having a public comment period that closes Jan. 20 for written feedback, residents will be able to voice their opinions about the suggested fee hikes at a public hearing on Jan. 5 at the Sandy Hook Chapel from 6 to 8 p.m., park superintendent Jen Nersesian said.

“We are committed to keeping the park affordable but also want to provide visitors with the best possible experience,” Nersesian said in a statement. “The money from the camping and parking fees will help improve our visitor facilities and services.”

Congressman Frank Pallone (D-6th Dist.), upset that the fee increases may put the park out of reach for some residents, had asked for a public hearing.

Gateway National Recreation Area is proposing to increase camping and parking fees in the park. Camping fees would go from $20 to $30 starting in the 2015 season. Parking fees at Sandy Hook would go from $15 to $20 per day and from $75 to $100 for a season pass in 2017.

Oversized vehicles – those larger than 20 feet -- would be charged $50 a day and $200 for the season, up from $30 and $150, respectively.

Nersesian noted this would be the first parking fee increase at Sandy Hook since 2012 and the first ever hike for the camping program.

Park visitors with senior or access passes would be charged half price for parking, as they are currently.

Residents may also submit written suggestions, comments and concerns online at Gateway_Fee_increase@nps.gov, or at the following address:

Office of the Superintendent

Gateway National Recreation Area
ATTN: Proposed parking and camping fee increase
210 New York Ave., Staten Island, NY 10305

[jigfreak]

Congressman Frank Pallone (D-6th Dist.), upset that the fee increases may put the park out of reach for some residents, had asked for a public hearing.



Pallone is upset the fee increases might put the park out of reach? Give me an effing break. He isn't too upset that the sand replenishment will put the jetties out of reach for the fishermen. Just shows that fishermen don't matter to this guy. What a tool.

[finchaser]

:clapping:^^^^^:clapping:

Pallone :2flip: