Surfcasting 201 - The Surfcasters' Bible....Artificial Only thread.... [Archive]

DarkSkies

07-13-2012, 03:29 PM

However, throughout my travels in different states, I have run into a lot of folks who are really trying to catch striped bass on Artificials.....

Some of them, unbelievably, have never caught a bass this way.

I imagine them reading the reports of some of us, and saying to themselves...
"These guys are full of BS.....HOW the HECK can they catch all those fish, when I can't even catch one?" :huh:

First off, I want to let you folks out there know that if you can't catch bass on artificials, you aren't alone....
There are many times I walk the beach on the way home and see people trying, and not a lot of catching going on...
I feel bad for these folks...especially when I see a Dad with his Son, and see they are both trying, giving it their best....

DarkSkies

07-13-2012, 04:08 PM

I think back to when I started using artificials. to catch my first keeper bass, and remember the difficulties I had,....the days turned into months, and finally years.....:embarassed:

Because I have to be quite honest here....
I have been fishing for striped bass since I was 10 years old....
And caught plenty of them using clams and other bait....

But once I made the transition to artificials....
It took me two years of effort to catch my first keeper bass....

Plenty of short fish, bluefish, and "almost" keepers during that time...
But I really didn't understand the big picture, and didn't have enough skill to know about time, tides, moon phases, where fish were feeding in the water column, and most importantly, presentation skills.

And, there was no internet to help me, had to do it all by trial and error, and some mentors I was lucky enough to meet along the way.....

DarkSkies

07-13-2012, 04:11 PM

So I thought this thread could be Strictly about Surfcasting Tips for Using Artificials....
and maybe the thoughts that go through your head when you are out there....

I have some things I may be posting here from time to time as I get a chance...
For example, some may recall me saying "A good surfcaster...." as a preface to many of my reports, etc. As time permits I will try to search for them and post them here.....

In the meantime if any of you want to talk about what works for you when using artificials, and any general or specific suggestions about what you do to catch fish, feel free to jump in....thanks! :HappyWave:

storminsteve

07-13-2012, 06:22 PM

Learn one beach at a time-
I think one of the things you told me is to learn one beach at a time. I am amazed at the subtleties you get into, the level of detail in your thinking. Your advice to me the other night was spot on. I am beginning to think you can see them under water. And to think that way back when you were a googan who took 2 years to catch a keeper!:ROFLMAO :HappyWave:

paco33

07-13-2012, 11:40 PM

Don't be a superman with your casts. Sometimes the fish are right at your feet.

DarkSkies

07-15-2012, 12:56 PM

Thanks and good suggestions guys, keep em coming....:HappyWave:

Learn one beach at a time-
I think one of the things you told me is to learn one beach at a time. I am amazed at the subtleties you get into, the level of detail in your thinking. Your advice to me the other night was spot on. I am beginning to think you can see them under water. :HappyWave:

Steve, that's part of my problem, part of the addiction. I have gotten to know the places I fish like the back of my hand. I really have a sense of where they might be when I'm casting. There are times when I'm home at night, and the winds and the tides will be such that I feel the fish are calling me..:drool: I'm compelled to be out there, whether I catch or not, because the conditions compel me to......:kooky:

Once you get to that point, a good surfcaster looks to travel to different areas and apply what they have learned to these new places, making note of conditions that are similar and trying to see if the fish will be there as well.

*******

How many times have you been out there, and praying for a fish?.....

"Lord Save me from the Skunk...."

It's 3am....
you've been fishing all night....

Your body is soaked with sweat....
Been hit by a few waves...each time reminding you how good it feels to be alive....and out there fishin......:cool:

You're casting, and casting.....
Not a tap.........

You put in a Prayer to King Neptune....:kooky:
even that doesn't work....

So you say the words, out loud..or maybe you mutter them under your breath.....Lord, save me from the Skunk...."

You continue casting and casting....
Some casts, you actually close your eyes,,,,trying to sense, when a fish may be near the end of your line......:rolleyes:

And Finally..... you get that hit.....:drool:
The one you've been waiting for, at the end of your line.....

Your Adrenalin pumps up.....:dribble:
The groggy half-asleep head on your shoulders shakes itself into action....
Your fingers and arms, instinctively know what to do......
Your hookset is solid.....
and you have that one fish...that you asked for...to save you from the Skunk....:) :fishing:

storminsteve

07-15-2012, 01:27 PM

:thumbsup:Amen, brother!

hookset

07-15-2012, 06:14 PM

Your Adrenalin pumps up.....:dribble:
The groggy half-asleep head on your shoulders shakes itself into action....
Your fingers and arms, instinctively know what to do......
Your hookset is solid.....
and you have that one fish...that you asked for...to save you from the Skunk....:) :fishing:

I hear you, know that feeling.

surfstix1963

07-15-2012, 07:13 PM

Learn to present the plugs properly,then learn when to use them and have a good understanding of why you chose them.Learn everything you can about a specific plug the how and why it is designed the way it is,if you do this presenting it will give you a head start to the learning game.You don't take a metal lip in a heavy heave and if you don't have current a darter is a waste of time leave it home etc.

CharlieTuna

07-17-2012, 08:08 PM

Monty

07-18-2012, 08:06 AM

"Quote Originally Posted by surfstix1963 View Post
Learn to present the plugs properly,then learn when to use them and have a good understanding of why you chose them.Learn everything you can about a specific plug the how and why it is designed the way it is,if you do this presenting it will give you a head start to the learning game.You don't take a metal lip in a heavy heave and if you don't have current a darter is a waste of time leave it home etc."

Spot on advice surfstix.

Presentation and selecting the correct plug/metal rubber. Surftstix that's it in a nutshell for me.
Its what I need to improve on and its also the most fun aspect of surf fishing for me.
Learning, trying out what works and doesn't. Figuring it out. So much to learn.
Presentation, presentation, presentation, presentation......presentation.

storminsteve

07-18-2012, 10:06 PM

Fish the tides. I knew a little about this already, especially in the back of the raritan bay. I assumed the ocean was more flexible, but dark helped me dial in a little better. All I can say is I want to learn the hard and soft structure better. Learning that there are times when it will be totally dead and another time when its alive with fish. I give you guys credit for fishing all the hours you do. I would never have seen that from fishing 2 hours.

DarkSkies

07-19-2012, 08:22 PM

Steve, you already have a great natural instinct.
Honestly, it didn't use to be that hard.

I remember a few years ago, maybe 6, 7. The peanuts were thick in the back of the bay and you could go to Sandy Hook at night, throw a storm shad, and catch some nice bass into the teens, casting from most of the beaches there.

Because the fish were so thick and the food so abundant, it didn't matter much what part of the tide you fished. As long as you threw those shads in the dark you were assured of getting a few bass.

Now that things are different, it seems to me, in certain areas, there is a feed during a particular time. Finchaser is finding the feed related to beginning and end of day. I'm finding it related to the tide.

The food moves in and out with the tides, and when I can focus on some of that, I can find fish. Last night I went to some sure-fire places and the fish just weren't there....tide and lack of forage where I was probably had a lot to do with that....as they say.....hey that's fishing....:fishing:

Great thread so far people, keep up the good work. :HappyWave:

finchaser

07-19-2012, 11:28 PM

I'm also playing the cooler temperatures at different stages of the tide that turns them on sometimes as much as 10 degrees

DarkSkies

07-26-2012, 04:37 PM

Fin makes a great point here. I'm finding the fish to be sluggish at certain tide stages. If you want to increase your chances of bass success during the hot summer doldrums, being a little obsessive about finding cooler water will help you. It's so important I will avoid places I feel the water is too hot for good artificial action.

And remember, this is in reference to fishing artificials.....it's my experience that when fishing bait this can be important, but is less critical.

DarkSkies

07-26-2012, 04:53 PM

The Value of the One...as Opposed to Many.....
There are times when you hear reports here about multiple fish....
Those are great times, and the adrenalin you feel if you're lucky to be in on a double digit (or, more rare, triple digit) bite is off the charts....
That adrenalin can be addictive.
I should know, because that adrenalin, and looking for that to happen, has me hooked...:o

It doesn't always happen that way, though...
Even for the best of the best, on an average night if you get a few fish, it's a good night....:thumbsup:

What if you fish all night, and can't find any fish at all? :huh:
Sometimes that's just the way it is.
As we say, hey that's fishing....

Hovever, if you do get a fish, even one or 2....the feeling to me, is sometimes more triumphant, than catching fish after fish.....
Some put it in simple terms....
"Hey you found a lucky fish...."

Yup, I agree....

But sometimes it's much more, psychologically...

That one or 2 fish....that you hunted for and found despite conditions not being optimal....sometimes makes it all worthwhile....

DarkSkies

07-26-2012, 05:12 PM

I was talking about this with a sitemember and friend the other night. He mostly fishes the LI Sound.
He's a very good fisherman in his own regard, and seems to catch fish when not many others are able to....

He's recently gotten addicted to sight fishing the bays, coves, and shallow rockpiles of the Sound.
He explained to me that on a normal trip, they may raise a few bass.
The hookup and release may only be one fish, for the whole day.
What they try to do is find feeding bass in the shallows, sneak up on them,, and then target the largest bass to try and catch......
Sounds do-able, but in reality it ain't that easy.....

And that, therefore, was the challenge, as he explained to me....

"Rich, I know how to catch bass...I've caught thousands in my lifetime.
At some point I asked myself....OK now what's next, what is my next challenge? And this is it for me.
Even though I know how to catch bass on flys, the yak, and from the surf, the chasing after and hunting down of the fish, really gets me going.
I get more satisfaction out of going out, hunting bass all morning, and maybe landing just one.
The feeling of teasing that one fish, to hit your artificial presentation, when it is normally feeding on crabs and live forage, is addictive! I would rather do that, than catch 10 bass in a blitz...."

So, in a sense, he explained to me his new-found perspective, of hunting for fish...
Not the easy ones, but the difficult ones...

And the satisfaction, and the adrenalin rush he gets, from targeting and catching these bass.....

I couldn't agree more....
Monty mentioned something about perspective, and I wanted to tie that comment into this conversation I had with my friend from LI.

Good stuff guys....:thumbsup:

paco33

07-26-2012, 07:25 PM

ISo, in a sense, he explained to me his new-found perspective, of hunting for fish...
Not the easy ones, but the difficult ones...

And the satisfaction, and the adrenalin rush he gets, from targeting and catching these bass.....

I couldn't agree more....
Monty mentioned something about perspective, and I wanted to tie that comment into this conversation I had with my friend from LI.

Good stuff guys....:thumbsup:

I agree too. Finding one bass or even a blue when there are no fish around is a good feeling.

Monty

07-26-2012, 09:28 PM

I agree too. Finding one bass or even a blue when there are no fish around is a good feeling.
I'm with you on this too. I have many outings where I'll catch one Striper (not stripper SS), and sure feels good catching that one.
Seeing Dark (or others on this site) on some of the outings land one bass, I give credit for resiliency and skill to find and fool that fish with an artificial. Takes more skill in catching one bass than 5 or 10 at times (at my skill level catching that one bass is pretty good for me :fishing: (blind squirrel finding a nut) at times).
The degree of difficulty can be pretty high based on the location, weather, tide, bait present and lack of sleep.
Never mind the fact that most of the bass are dead.

jigfreak

07-27-2012, 08:32 PM

Nothing like it nailing fish on artis. Its the highest high. Making them hit something that is not what they are eating. Since rubber became popular it has become a lot easier. I think its a hard sell to get them to hit plastic plugs. They will but what in the fish kingdom is hard when a bass hits it except for lobsters and crabs. Definitely an adrenalin rush.

DarkSkies

08-15-2012, 09:56 AM

Nothing like it nailing fish on artis. Its the highest high. . Definitely an adrenalin rush.

I wanted to respond to what Jigfreak said.
I would call this an addiction for some of us....at least it is for me...:o :)

The other night I had somewhat of a decent bite......and as I usually do, I was thinking about fishing, and what it means to me....

Fishing gradually slowed after about an hour, and I knew it was over and time to get out of there and on the road to work.

For me, that's the saddest part of any fishing trip, realizing the bite is lessening and it's time to wrap things up..:(

***********
The Candle in the Night.....
So in my head, I was thinking of the experience, as that of a candle lit in the night....
That candle could mean a lot of things, to a lot of people.....

The chance to get away and recharge your batteries...
To escape the hassles of everyday life, if but for just a while....

The chance to get out there, and in solitude reflect on your life, and where it's going
(some have said I'm too analytical, and think too much...maybe that's true...) :laugh:

The chance for just a brief space in time....to connect with nature and all it's greatness....at a cost that is minimal...for the benefits derived......

I've said many times over that Fishing is Tonic for the Soul....

I was thinking of the bite, as a Candle, that can go out any time.....
It flickers in the night....so tenuous....so uncertain....
When the Bite is on,,,,you have to focus everything you have, on that moment....
Every fiber of your experience must be ready, sharp, poised to take advantage of the good action that you have been fortunate enough to find....
And enjoy the action you do, savoring every last moment like the juices from a freshly grilled steak that you just cooked on the grill.....:drool:

And savor it you must, because you don't know....
At any single moment that action could, and will, shut down....
There are no guarantees when you find them feeding deep in the night...
The bite could evaporate before your very eyes...

So you fish it hard...focused, and in the Zone.....
Enjoying every last bit of that activity.....

Realizing that like a Candle, the bite will flicker in the Night....subject to the whims of uncertainty in much the same way a candle is subject to being extinguished in the wind....
Until the Flame of the Candle, goes out.....:( :fishing:

storminsteve

08-16-2012, 10:10 PM

What would happen if the candle that lights your brain gets blown out?:laugh: :HappyWave:

surfstix1963

08-17-2012, 11:38 AM

Oh hell that's been blown out for years I've been trying to re-light it for the last ten or so years keeps going out must be the wind blowing through my ears.

DarkSkies

08-17-2012, 01:56 PM

What would happen if the candle that lights your brain gets blown out?:laugh: :HappyWave:

Oh hell that's been blown out for years I've been trying to re-light it for the last ten or so years keeps going out must be the wind blowing through my ears.

Steve....:moon: :HappyWave:

Surfstix.....I'm glad someone else can share this feeling too....:HappyWave:

surfstix1963

08-18-2012, 06:29 PM

:HappyWave:I'm just willing to admit it.

surferman

08-20-2012, 07:40 PM

Oh hell that's been blown out for years I've been trying to re-light it for the last ten or so years keeps going out must be the wind blowing through my ears.

Steve....:moon: :HappyWave:

Surfstix.....I'm glad someone else can share this feeling too....:HappyWave:

:HappyWave:I'm just willing to admit it.

:dYou guys are really out there, lol!
Great thread btw.

DarkSkies

10-22-2012, 10:36 PM

Thanks for the kind words, all.....

( Surfstix has told me privately that if you notice any of that wind blowing through his ears. please point it out so we can turn the fan off......:laugh: :HappyWave: )

Some advice I gave today..... Fishing Low Vs High Tide.....
Low tide can be productive, but lately for me it has been about high tide.

When low tide can be productive for artificials.....

1. If you are fishing areas where some of the water is deep, and fish and bait are scattered...the low tide will tend to concentrate them in seams, cuts,or areas we talked about, where they can hide till the tide starts to move again.

2. The presentation and options...sometimes when the tide is high I do better with presentation on the bottom...bucktails,and rubber if the water is 5' deeper or more.....
This all depends on the season and time of year, but it's critical to know if the fish are "looking up" or "looking down".

3. As the tide drops out, I find I do better with plugs, that work the top half of the water column, as at that point the fish may be looking up.

4. One thing that is critical for presentation for me is the strength of the current.....and the pull, of that current.

5. For example, the outgoing tide, if you fish certain areas, will produce a rip on some places, and therefore a "pull" on your plug.

6. For that reason, I like the ebb tide for a lot of the plugging I do as I feel it allows me to control the speed of the retrieve.
I can therefore slow down the retrieve better on a rip in an ebb tide.

7. When the flood tide comes in, I still like to plug, because that's one of my favorite ways of nailing fish....but....
The tide coming in forces me to retrieve just a bit faster to keep in contact with my plug....so if the fish are sluggish I may miss some of the action that a slower retrieve would allow me to find.....

*****
Note, the above is specific to fishing the surf at night, and the currents and rips I find at various places where I'm concentrating both on hard and soft structure.

Inlets are different.
Rips around points of land are different.

The approach for fishing those would also be different, for me.....

And, as always, the area you fish, has it's own times that the fish may turn on and feed...
I have found areas as close as 1/2 of a mile apart will have different feeding times for night surf fishing....

It's your job, as a surfcaster who wants to succeed, to discover those feeding patterns for that specific area, and deal with them in a way that will maximize your fishing time........

Hope this helps....:thumbsup:
.

Monty

10-23-2012, 12:16 AM

Great post Dark :HappyWave:
Here are three pics. First one is a rip that has been very productive for me (except this year :huh:...I have lost a few fish and missed a bunch of hits there this year, pretty sure this getting old thing has caused my cat like reflexes to deteriorate to unprecedented levels resulting in missed hits and ridicules amounts of lost fish (story for another thread....or not)).
Under some conditions at night, lower tide, I can wade out and cast into it (fun). Rubber Hogys have done well for me there as well as needles and teasers. False dawn, cloudy days and even some sunny ones have been productive with pencils, assorted poppers, metals and teasers.. to a lesser level metal lip plugs. The rip is productive from in close (caught fish 10 feet from the beach), to as far as I could cast (100 yards+). Areas like this can be very productive :thumbsup:
I like fishing this area more at the lower 1/2 of the tide. Not because its more productive, but its more fun for me to be able to wade out onto a bar that is there. Out going has been a bit more productive.
I enjoy fishing low tide more than high, throwing artificials I tend to find a lot more structure (points, cuts, pools, rips, sand bars).
The second is one of many doubles caught there.
The third pic is of white water....:)

http://rocksimpson.com/images/2012_old_Rip.jpg

http://rocksimpson.com/images/2012_old_Rip_double.jpg

http://rocksimpson.com/images/2012_old_ww.jpg

storminsteve

10-23-2012, 10:06 AM

Nice rip monty. As for the last pic I can see why they call you white water monty. :HappyWave:
I like fishing rips because the fish will come in closer looking for bait. Cool tips guys thanks.

cowherder

10-23-2012, 06:53 PM

Always a wealth of information here, I feel like I still have so much to learn every time I read stuff like this. Thank you.

plugcrazy

10-24-2012, 09:37 AM

Great info about low vs high tide presentation dark.Nice pics and explanation of a rip monty. I also look at the bait that is around. don't usually use a bucktail with a teaser from the surf, but lately I have been using one. They are on small bait unless the bunker are around. A small ava with teaser is a good thing to use right now too.

DarkSkies

11-11-2012, 03:04 PM

The Ocean in a lot of NJ areas is in the low 50's. Bass are usually active and aggressive at that temp, but last night I found them to be very sluggish, just bumping the plug. Lots of things that didn't fit a pattern last night. Several fish hooked in the head, quite a few missed fish, and once you missed the hookset they would not come back for it.

My best assessment of this behavior is that with a temp drop of around 8 degrees in 1 week, that has been a shock to their system. You might not notice that if on a boat and come across actively feeding fish, but for the surf bite absent large quantities of bait, these bass are a challenge to catch right now, at least for me......

Remember if you are out fishing at night it's a lot different than the day bite. You may only have one or 2 shots at a fish. If you blow it you might just be telling your friends about "the one that got away" instead of having actual proof.

I know this because........:bucktooth:

I was that guy last night......:beatin:

DarkSkies

04-06-2013, 11:40 AM

Great info about low vs high tide presentation dark.Nice pics and explanation of a rip monty. I also look at the bait that is around. .

Thanks Plugcrazy. I thought I would add to this with some thoughts I had today.

Presentation and where the fish are....

1. At different times of the season, day, or moon phase, fish will be sitting in different levels of the water column.
2. Your job as a fisherman is to figure out where that is.
3. If you don't present to them where there are sitting you will never know that they are there.
4. In general, (my experience) colder weather, or a cold front, tends to put fish down, where they will sit closer to the bottom.
5. In my experience, this will hold, in general, unless they are feeding actively on bait, at which point they may rise to the surface.
6. There are so many variations for this, that the best thing I can say, is you need to understand the water you are fishing in front of you, and think about moon stage, time of day, current flow (during strong current flow fish at times tend to stay on the bottom or sides where current is less strong), water clarity, water temperature, day vs night time fishing, and some other ones I probably forgot to mention.
7. If you can figure this out, for the place and time you are fishing, it will allow you to work your casts more efficiently.
8. You will only be working on the part of the water column where the fish are most highly concentrated.
9. If you really try to keep disciplined about this, you will see that it will result in more hookups, and more fish.

jigfreak

04-06-2013, 12:28 PM

3. If you don't present to them where there are sitting you will never know that they are there.

My #1 rule when I'm out and about. Fish are still on the bottom where I'm fishing. One hour before sunrise they rise to feed and then they disappear again. Gotta work that water column.

robmedina

05-21-2013, 03:44 PM

I have read through both Surfcasting 101 and Surfcasting 102. Great information guys- thank you! This year has been actually my first year of really giving Surf fishing a go. I of course have wet a line many a time over the years but it was never with a pre-conceived knowledge of what's there or what are they feeding on etc. It was more- Hey kids want to go to the beach for the day???? Me fish they play kind of thing. So that being said- I have committed more time and energy in learning about the surf. I am starting to learn how to read the beach. Watch tide charts, wind direction, water temp etc. I have primarily been fishing clams and/or bunker. I landed a 20" Striper last night on the out going. I know - a 'biggen' lol! well anyway- it dawned on me that if I do catch a big striper- will that be what I came for??? and the answer was no. I think fishing with bait is great. But I am a little on the high strung side. I have always fished lures for other species of fish and really enjoy figuring out the what the when and the how. Now that I am going for Surf- it is a whole new arena. You can't just site down on a Saturday afternoon and watch 20 shows on surf fishing like you can on large mouth bass or walleye. So my question is- can anyone recommend a book or DVD series that I can go buy to learn more about fishing plugs, lures etc. I know John Skinner sells a book called fishing the bucktail and I am really leaning towards starting there. I think if I learn with a bucktail to fish different applications I could then understand perhaps a little better what I need to do. Anyway- Thanks again for all your wisdom. Sorry that this is one big paragraph- the format wouldn't let start a new paragraph- just runs together.

surfstix1963

05-22-2013, 05:20 AM

Bucktails and tins (hopkins&kastmaster) are great for searching the water column and will work at any speed from slow bouncing the bottom to ripping them if the need arises.Always use the lightest bucktail that will get to the bottom pay attention to the speed of the current and switch up or down in weight accordingly white with red pork rind will generally always work day or night.Bass are generally anywhere from the bottom to around 6 ft. off the bottom in deeper water.Structure,structure & structure.Learn to read the beach it changes constantly when you catch a fish look at the water why was that fish there bait,hole,cut,rip,drain etc. if you can't recognize structure you won't be very good at this game.Always look for the funny water.

hookset

05-22-2013, 10:04 AM

welcome rob. What surftsix said is great I agree. You also need to spend time on the water. As you said you can read tons of stuff on the internet but putting it into practical use is the thing. Spend time out there and put it all in a log. Learning to read structure beach or bayside is all important.casting where fish are not sitting will get you nothing. hope this helps and let us know of your progress.

robmedina

05-22-2013, 12:25 PM

Monty

05-22-2013, 01:44 PM

Thanks for the welcome hookset! My Wife just ordered m two books for Fathers day. Fishing the bucktail by John Skinner and Fishing with Bucktails by Doc Miller. While I am wetting a line with bait tonight, I will be throwing a bucktail with my other rod to get my journey started.

Welcome aboard. There are a few books discussed on this thread:
http://stripersandanglers.com/Forum/showthread.php?2007-Surf-fishing-books&highlight=BOOK

I like Zeno's books, he is funny, intense and has a bunch of information and examples in his books.

Depending on where you are fishing a bomber or even the SP Minnow may also be a good artificial to throw tonight.

robmedina

05-22-2013, 02:04 PM

Thanks Monty!

jigfreak

05-22-2013, 08:56 PM

Rob read Skinners book and practice practice and practice some more. I nail some big fish every year bucktailing and if you ever hit montauk its all about the buck and pork or buck and grub. The thing to remember is if you are dragging on the sand it's too heavy. Getting caught in the rocks too heavy also. If you are not hitting bottom you are not in the zone either. Start out at a sandy beach with some current and work the current line. Once you get good at that you can graduate to the rocks and hard structure. Good luck

robmedina

05-23-2013, 12:26 AM

Practice is exactly what I need. Tonight I went out. was fishing with clams and bunker. I rigged one of my rods with a bucktail but I wasn't quite set up. I should have used my 9 foot rod but it was rigged with bait and in the water, so I used my 11' rod but ...well just not right. I did manage one 34 -1/2" striper though. Released to fight another day.1704317044

robmedina

05-23-2013, 12:26 AM

oh and that striper was on clam not the bucktail.

DarkSkies

05-23-2013, 12:27 AM

Nicely done Rob and welcome aboard. :HappyWave:

blitzhunter

09-09-2013, 11:40 AM

Don't know if this has been said before but check your knots every time.

plugginpete

02-18-2014, 09:04 AM

If you are plugging an area and are getting no hits try varying your retrieve and maybe that will work. Try this before leaving for another spot. And nice fish Rob!

buckethead

02-24-2014, 02:15 PM

When you upgrade hooks on plugs balance is key. You want to use the same sizes if you want it to swim straight. You can usually go up one size before you have a problem. On some plugs I have switched to one treble, taking the back one off. When you do that you want to make sure the treble is not too big for the plug or it will ruin the action.

DarkSkies

04-30-2014, 10:00 AM

(previously posted)
http://stripersandanglers.com/Forum/showthread.php?8471-Your-Best-Artificials-from-the-Surf-this-Year-and-Why

Presentation and where the fish are....

1. At different times of the season, day, or moon phase, fish will be sitting in different levels of the water column.
2. Your job as a fisherman is to figure out where that is.
3. If you don't present to them where there are sitting you will never know that they are there.
4. In general, (my experience) colder weather, or a cold front, tends to put fish down, where they will sit closer to the bottom.
5. In my experience, this will hold, in general, unless they are feeding actively on bait, at which point they may rise to the surface.
6. There are so many variations for this, that the best thing I can say, is you need to understand the water you are fishing in front of you, and think about moon stage, time of day, current flow (during strong current flow fish at times tend to stay on the bottom or sides where current is less strong), water clarity, water temperature, day vs night time fishing, and some other ones I probably forgot to mention.
7. If you can figure this out, for the place and time you are fishing, it will allow you to work your casts more efficiently.
8. You will only be working on the part of the water column where the fish are most highly concentrated.
9. If you really try to keep disciplined about this, you will see that it will result in more hookups, and more fish.

DarkSkies

04-30-2014, 10:38 AM

(previously posted)
Winter fishing thread...

Confidence in what you are throwing....
For the new guys - finding a "Go To" Profile and presentation that works for you....

I thought I would offer this to any other new fisherman/woman out there who is learning to fish with artificials...one who is still primarily fishing bait....because of lack of confidence and success, with artificials.....

Again,, with the disclaimer that what works for me, may not always work for you folks....so this suggestion is intended to help you find something that works exactly for you....

You will see a lot of discussion on "Go To" lures, plugs, etc etc.,....
For me, that doesn't work because of my obsessiveness. I feel that different conditions can be such that a slightly different plug or presentation can give me an edge sometimes....

other times this does not hold true. As long as you can get your offering to within a foot or so of feeding fish and can mimic the forage/bait movement, you should get action.....

Then why is a Go-To lure or plug so important for the new guys????
One word....Confidence.....

My suggestions....
1. Find a lure or profile (could be metal, wood, plastic, rubber, bucktail, etc) that works for you and you seem to be successful on.

2. When you are out there, and the conditions permit it, throw your "Go to" as your first offering. If that is the right profile for the forage that is there, you will catch....

3. But sometimes it will not be...and some people would say you would be stupid for throwing it....ex throwing metal when it's purely a plug bite and they won't touch anything else, not even rubber....so there is some thinking required on your part here, to implement these suggestions...

4. By throwing something you have extreme confidence in, you will telegraph that confidence through your entire retrieve,.... be more alert, and paying more attention, so there is less likelihood you will lose a fish by being unprepared for the strike......

5. If there is no activity on that after 5 or 10 minutes, try something else.

Ex - when I was a child, my Dad taught me how to bowl, by "following through" - he explained that no matter how well I thought my throw would be, it would never optimal unless I saw my hand following through, and continuing in a perfect swing, to mimic what "should" get me a strike or at least 9 pins in the first frame....

so, in essence, he taught me to pay attention to form, visualize myself being successful, and that visualization WOULD make me successful.....it did work, and when I did poorly he would always point out how I failed to "follow through"....
Looking back on that early advice, I remember that he was absolutely right....

** John...I had a really good in-depth post on when and where and how to fish bucktails....will post it when I get a chance......
Anyone else wants to add to this thread...feel free....thanks.....:HappyWave:

DarkSkies

04-30-2014, 11:00 AM

^ (Previously posted)

Bucktails......
Last year (2012) it was a goal to get keeper bass every month of the year from land and do it without leaving NJ....I did,, but July and August were extremely tough for me....managed a few keepers in July but very difficult as most fish were gone. I was picking away at needle in a haystack fish...

August... have to check my logs for exact number but I think I managed to scratch only one or two legal bass. One of them took hours of casting and moving from spot to spot.... I remember spending about 12 hours of fishing over a 2 night period. Even with the time and tide in my favor I could not find one....

The one thing that finally saved me was a 1/2 oz bucktail with grub....white......

.,my experience with bucktails is you have to tailor them to the
1.depth of the water
2.the current
3. Stage of tide

Where you are fishing -
There are times when you defiinitely need 2 oz in deeper water, rough surf, or the fast current of a full or new moon.,...but that also depends on tide stages...
There will be times during a new moon tide, which I feel can be stronger at certain times of the year, when I am throwing a 2 oz, but then at the end of the tide I will be throwing 1/2 oz....

When I fish inlets, rivers. or strong rips - at minimum I have 3 different sizes with me to adjust for changes in current flow.
You should get in the habit of doing that too....with bucktails the best place for me to be is bouncing just off the bottom. When fish are stacked up it is less critical but there aren't a lot of weeks when you have that.

The best bites I find on bucktails in NJ generally last from 1-2 hours at a time and are definitely stage of tide dependent.
Migrating forage will sometimes extend that bite to a little longer, but as you fish more you will see a definite feeding window.

** Important points -
A If the tide lessens and you are dragging on the bottom because your bucktail or jig is too heavy you're not presenting effectively.
B. If the jig or bucktail is too light, and you are not bouncing the bottom or close to it, you could be missing all the fish that are sitting on the bottom half and never know it....
C. Even with all our advice, the only thing that will make it work for you is to buy cheap, practice, don't be afraid to lose a few. You need to undertsand what it takes to get hung up and lose rigs, before you can learn the gentle finesse of keeping them just off the bottom

D. Bucktails and bouncing bottom, IMO are not as popular in NJ as they are in LI, RI and MA. I have friends who bucktail or jig from land and consistently outcatch everyone else in cold water. or when the water is so hot it feels like bathwater (bass are sluggish at both these extreme temps)

Learning to use them will bring you rewards as one night you will find the fish you didn't think was there, you will land that fish, being the only one on the beach, and let out a Caveman yell of triumph.... :cool: ...it will be sweet....but you have to lose some rigs to get to that point...JMO

Hope that helps.....

jigfreak

05-31-2014, 06:41 PM

Good advice on bucktails ds I do the same thing. If you don't carry different sizes for different stages you will lose the fish. for slack tide dont forget to bring a popper or plugs because the fish will then move up and down in the water.
Another thing I like to do when the water is colder is let the fish tell you what retrieve they want. I start out slow but some times they want it fast. You have to experiment with different speeds and change it up if you want to get fish when it's a little colder in the water or when a cold front moves in. A lot of guys will leave if the bite is not hot. change up your retrieve and you could still pick away at them.

hookset

06-05-2014, 01:09 AM

Another thing I like to do when the water is colder is let the fish tell you what retrieve they want..

Spot on. sometimes conventional wisdom doesn't work. One of the great things about fishing is it can be different every time. When one tbing doesn't work try the total opposite.

dogfish

09-19-2014, 08:07 AM

^^^^^^^ Agree, well said. Have been reading a lot of talk on here about albies lately. You want to use the lightest line possible. No hardware direct tie. Fluoro leader for calm water. Not always necessary but since they are so spooky you want to have all the advantages. They are hammering them a little South of us in Rhody. Fun fish to catch but they taste worse than bluefish.

surfstix1963

09-19-2014, 12:02 PM

First things first learn how to read a beach understand different structures and how the fish and bait utilize it if you don't understand it surf fishing is useless. Don't buy into a ton of different plugs if you decide to make the switch to artificials, first buy a few learn them then move on to others understand them and gain confidence in their use be prepared for a lot of fishless trips. it happens at first. you need to dedicate yourself to it.

Tins are a good start they can be worked in any part of the water column.

I will tend to tell you to avoid the surface plugs at first usually there are many more fish under what you are seeing on top. Resist the temptation to chase blues down the beach. the stripers are often right behind them feeding on the scraps.

Check your weather before you go and pack what you need.
obviously if the wind is cranking in your face a bomber or SP isn't going far. grab some heavy needles and bottle plugs for example.

Rather then moving constantly work the area you are in. cast at 12 O'Clock and vary your casts clockwise then counter clockwise (fan casting when you are not in a crowd can eliminate a great amount of area without moving constantly).

Understand bait types and choose your plugs accordingly. Don't be afraid to think out of the box. It will often save a trip.

There are only general rules for plugging some plugs can be worked differently then designed and that just may turn the fishes head. One general rule is fish lures slowly(if your bored more then likely your doing it right). you often don't realize how much line you are moving. Bait don't swim that fast so your plug shouldn't either fish ambush their prey if it is moving quickly they may turn their noses up to it(especially bigger stripers they are lazy).Take a look at your reel specs and see how much line you are taking up on one crank and you will understand better how fast and how much line you are moving.

Think like a fish.My wife always says I'm a nut when I tell people to look for the funny water because that will be some sort of structure. You just need to figure out what kind it is and how to utilize it. Like Monty always says fish the white water.It is high in oxygen and the wave pushes the bait into the foam left over, this is when the fish feed momentarily in between waves (wait for the wave to start breaking and cast over it and start working the white water). Don't ever lift your plug out of the water reel it right up to the beach just be careful setting the hook if they are feeding on the beach lip so you don't eat it.

Keep your hooks sharp,your line should be free of frays braid or mono line is often overlooked and lets face it that brings the fish to the beach.

Make sure your knots are tied correctly,tie your leaders at home so you have them when you need them.You don't want to be tying a leader while the fish are swimming past you.

On your wooden plugs if you use them, one thing that is often overlooked on wooden plugs is the barrel swivel,which is holding your hook to the plug they need to be inspected and changed every once in awhile they weaken over time and fail so the plug will need to be re-wired,if they are epoxy sealed inside and out they usually use hangers which cannot be replaced if something goes wrong with the plug.I have several SS darters that are headed for the can because the swivel is shot,most plastic plugs don't use swivels but the SS do.

DarkSkies

09-19-2014, 12:38 PM

^ You can tell by the words above that the guy typing them has decades of experience and has paid his dues. :thumbsup:
Thanks as always for unselfishly sharing the wealth of knowledge you have, Rich, and for being so patient with the new guys.
And thanks to you and all the members here who unselfishly give of themselves. :HappyWave:

buckethead

09-19-2014, 02:15 PM

understand bait and choose your plugs accordingly. Don't be afraid to think out of the box. it will often save a trip.

there are only general rules for plugging some plugs can be worked differently then designed and that just may turn the fishes head. One general rule is fish lures slowly(if your bored more then likely your doing it right). you often don't realize how much line you are moving. bait don't swim that fast so your plug shouldn't either. take a look at your reel and see how much line you are taking up on one crank and you will understand better how fast and how much line you are moving.

Think like a fish.My wife always says I'm a nut when I tell people to look for the funny water because that will be some sort of structure. you just need to figure out what kind it is.Like Monty always says -fish the white water. it is high in oxygen and the wave pushes the bait and the fish like that (wait for the wave to start breaking and cast over it and start working the foam). Don't ever lift your plug out of the water reel it right up to the beach just be careful setting the hook if they are feeding on the beach lip so you don't eat it.

Some great points SS. Learning to eliminate unproductive water is half the battle. Other wise you are wasting your time. Presentation is a key factor as well. Good thread. Dark you know I'm always glad to pitch in because you have a good group here. The ego boasting and chest pounding on other sites is very unappealing to me. The fishing reports where only a fish is posted and no details I call that chest pounding. If you don't want to share at least what you used keep the details and report to yourself. just my .02.

DarkSkies

09-20-2014, 12:24 PM

Well said, bucket. :HappyWave:
If you new guys want to learn, pay attention when buckethead posts as well. He's one of the old farts here. :moon: :laugh:
He knows stuff. :thumbsup: :HappyWave:

bassmansjc

09-29-2014, 09:38 PM

Monty Do you fish the Mass. Islands?

Monty

09-29-2014, 10:51 PM

Monty Do you fish the Mass. Islands?

Jersey until this year.
Just started getting my feet wet on LI this year.
Buckethead great point about fishing non productive water, something I need to really work on. Concentrating on the "funny water" like Stix mentions.
Recent trip covered a mile of water early am. Not much structure no action, hit an area with white water, very small area, just like that there was some action concentrated in it.
Would be best to sprint towards "funny water" and spend more time there fishing it. :idea:

surfstix1963

09-30-2014, 03:40 AM

Yeah I have a feeling I know where you were I was there last night I don't know what the hell happened there but no structure one giant sandbar and you only get to work the plug about 10 ft. before your dragging it over the bar and with no drop off at the beach its a waste of time for me maybe better at the flood but the ebb may as well fish the bay side deeper water and more current.Btw the fish were there but between the bar blocking them from getting to the beach and the boats blowing through them it just scattered them and put them down.I'll be taking that place off my list for now time to head east a little more.The few spots that did have "funny water" the bait ******* had 6 rods set up this is when I'd love to see a school of blues come through and take a few rods away one guy 6 effin rods.

Monty

09-30-2014, 06:59 AM

surfstix1963

10-01-2014, 05:25 AM

Yeah looks like a desert with a foot of water over it, structure is wiped out there.That beach used to be that big before all the dredging so I guess mother nature is putting it back.That little jetty does the job they need one on the other end off the point they wouldn't have to dredge anymore.

williehookem

10-02-2014, 11:34 AM

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
I fished the last few hours of out going and some of the incoming there. Maybe the exact opposite would be lot better. Was amazed at how far I could walk out on that bar. Seemed an enormous amount of sand there now, and there was a lot there before. Was my first time back there in months. Took a while just figuring out what happened. Got to one area that I had caught a few short bass earlier this year and made a cast, plug landed on land :don't know why: . I can't see *hit out there.

I think I know the area youre talking about. Has a huge bar. Will be good for when the sandeels show up. However word gets out quick and it will be like opening day of trout season. I remember one year there were guys spaced every 5 feet. Maybe 2010? Crazy stupid fishing brings everyone out of the woodwork.