Discussion: Fishing Rubber, covering all the Bases

[porgy75]

What are some of the first rubber you reach for durning these different times?

Night?
Day?
do you fish them differently during different tides. thannks

[fishinmission78]

High - outgoing - plugs
High - incoming - jigs and rubber or bait

[Frankiesurf]

Depends on current where you are fishing. I was at a spot last week that the current is BRUTAL on high moon tides.

Keep in mind that the water on high tide can be much, much higher depending where you are fishing.

With higher currents speeds and higher water, I will generally throw something that will dig a little deeper. Bucktail and rubber shads are always on the list. That is normally just a start. It, as always, depends on where the fish are holding. If they aren't deep or lower mid then I work my way up to the top of the water column.

For the stormy seas/rough water I try to throw anything that will hold or just stick with bucktails or heavy shads if you can't get the plug dug in. This also depends on which way the current is moving and also wind direction.

[DarkSkies]

We have a thread here called "Artificial Only, the Surfcasters' Bible..."
http://stripersandanglers.com/Forum/showthread.php?8511-Surfcasting-201-The-Surfcasters-Bible-Artificial-Only-thread

I'll probably talk about rubber in that thread as well.
However, rubber has so changed the surf fishing industry, and the way some of us fish, that I thought it would merit its own thread.

[DarkSkies]

Many in the Surf fishing world like to focus on big plugs, big wood, big darters, big pencils, etc....
That's great when there are 30lb bass swimming all over.

In recent years I've seen a decline in the times and occurrences of larger bass hitting our surf locations.
If you're still geared up only to catch these fish you might be missing out on a world of opportunity.

In my experience., there is nothing as attractive as a smaller profile to consistently catch bass.
My thinking behind this is along the following lines...

!. Bunker, larger herring,and mullet are not always around as forage fish. When they aren't, it's my experience that bass are less likely to hit the large profiles that some like to throw.

2. The small forage fish, rainfish, killies, spearing, sandeels, etc, are around for a longer part of the year. They are the first forage to show up in the Spring and some of the last to leave in the Fall. (generally speaking).

3. This stands to reason that bass spend more time eating this forage, because of the availibility.

4. Rubber most closely approximates this profile.

5. Learning to fish rubber effectively can increase your catching opportunities.

6. Learning to do this, on a regular basis, can increase your confidence as a fisherman.

[DarkSkies]

I thought some of ya's might like to talk about rubber and how it fits into the fishing you do.....

[Monty]

Well I like to fish 14" Hogys, black ones, almost never throw them in daylight.
I am trying to work in 10" and 7" into my "fishing style" and its been unsuccessful so far and that experiment is about done for now.
97% of the time I fish unweighted (without wobble head).
Its very important to be able to get them deep at times...lots of times.
Really hardly ever fished rubber shads and or jig heads with rubber until this year, and I still hardly ever throw them (I enjoy fishing other stuff).
So I carry a few rubber shads and 14" Hogys (and for now a couple 7" and 10" ones).
http://www.rocksimpson.com/images/2010_6_6_SB.jpg
http://www.rocksimpson.com/images/2010_5_30_B.jpg

[DarkSkies]

Good post, Monty....:thumbsup:

The 14" Hogy is a deadly offering. It can pull a fish out of inactivity on a night you think none are around. Rubber eels are the closest things to live or dead eels, without the scent.

I'm not sure eel scent matters as much as presentation, as you mentioned.

In July some guys I know landed a 45" bass from an Ocean County rockpile, throwing a 14" Hogy.
The guy had his sitting in bunker oil....
To some that might not make sense, after all how does an eel smell like a bunker? :huh:
I guess it made sense to that big bass, though, as the guy fishing the Hogy almost had the rod torn out of his hand....:dribble:












I noticed this in the winter as I would sometimes throw a 9" Sluggo while fishing the hot winter bite.
http://stripersandanglers.com/Forum/showthread.php?8168-Winter-Fishing-Thread&highlight=winter+fishing+thread


The reason I was throwing it was that there were bigger bass around. When you throw a 14" Hogy, I would think you are anticipating that as well. I think what the larger rubber profiles do, (when they aren't getting choopped in half by the smaller bluefish) :burn:, is to call out the bigger fish to action.

Or, they could be just the very thing that slapped the bass on the head as you swam it by them, causing a violent reaction strike..

Again, my observations are unscientific, but I noticed this time and time again in the Winter. The nights when there were mostly schoolie bass around they wouldn't touch the Sluggo I was throwing as it didn't fit the profile of the 4-5" sandeels that were around.

Bigger bass, though, seem to be less discriminating at times, in my experience....if it looks like food they're gonna take a swing at it.....:cool: And as a result, in some circumstances, IMO it's sometimes possible to "Call"" the bigger fish to the table using big rubber like that.


As Monty mentioned, sometimes these fish are deeper, sometimes not....
But you won't know that till you work all levels of the water column.....:learn:

[DarkSkies]

This thread is also for you new guys as well.
Don't beel bashful, things are never learned in life by being afraid to ask questions....:thumbsup:


And if you want to learn, here is your opportunity.....:headbang:

[clamchucker]

Very good thread. Before rubber we fished bucktails and pork rinds. We fished them a lot when the weather was bad or the water was colder. The different types of rubber have made it a lot easier for some of the younger folks to catch fish. It is as you said, the fish almost can not resist them. I like the standard fin-s 4" on a jig head. You can do better if you vary the weight of the jig with the current and depth of the water. I don't like to use the expensive pieces because there is always a chance a bluefish will come along and bite it in half. Keep it simple if you want to catch fish on rubber.

[surferman]

I can catch small bass in Cape May backwaters by the end of March using zooms and fin es'. They are a great year round thing to carry.

[jigfreak]

You can do better if you vary the weight of the jig with the current and depth of the water. I don't like to use the expensive pieces because there is always a chance a bluefish will come along and bite it in half. Keep it simple if you want to catch fish on rubber.

This is one of the keys to success. Throwing rubber on the top when they are eating crabs or shrimp on the bottom gets you nothing. dragging rubber too deep when they are crashing bait on the surface will someimes cause you to miss fish. You have to think of where they are. If crashing bait then by all means fish it light and fast. If on the bottom you need to be low and slow. I have seen a lot of dudes fish rubber and fail. They fish it too fast. What clamchucker said about changing the jig weights is golden. This is the only way you will be able to catch more than one fish in a bridge or rip situation.

[DarkSkies]

Great thread so far guys, appreciate the different thoughts. :thumbsup:

[cowherder]

Yes and you could add if you fish where there are bluefish around you will get chopped! I fished nomoco tonight until dark, incoming tide. started using the fin-s and got many bit in half. Isn't it amazing how they know just how to bite up to the hook? :kooky:
Then I switched to bucktail and porkrind and they were slamming it. Small blues but fun anyway, managed over 20.

[williehookem]

I really like the tsunami shads. They do tend to get bit in half by the blues tho.

[jigfreak]

Good thread. I wouldnt be caught dead without rubber. Sodbanks bridges, bulkheads, warm water disscharges. All places to throw small rubber. Not a big fan of the sluggo unless the sandeels are thick. Hope you guys are not offended by that. I'm big on fin s and the bass assassin and the riptide mullets. Go by the power plant and see what bait is always in the shallows and the cuts, you will see minnies there over all other bait. These three work for me. Fish them slow, twitch every once in a while. How fast I fish them depends on the current.

[fishinmission78]

I really like the tsunami shads. They do tend to get bit in half by the blues tho.

Wait until the bluefish leave, and the peanuts are running down the beach.. Fish a cut or inlet. They are a fall favorite of mine for when peanuts are thick.

[DarkSkies]

I had some additional thoughts.......


Fall Season - (Sept to December) Rubber strategies....

1. For me there's a transition period, early fall when the fish are picky. When throwing rubber, I throw small rubber like fin-s's and thinner paddle tails because that seems to represent the primary forage for some of the areas I like to fish.

2. An interesting thing, that I have noticed, is that for the fishing I do, the storm and tsunami shads don't seem to produce. I have fished them side by side for comparison, and haven't gotten any action compared with some of the smaller rubber I fish.

3. Once the mullet start leaving the bays and rivers, this changes a bit for me....the rubber shads start to be productive again....

4. This is just my experience,,,some of ya's may have different experiences...but found to be true for the areas I fish.







5. Some of ya's may have noticed different things or had success with other rubber, so far this fall, beginning in Sept.....


Again, I think the strategy that works best for you is should be tailored to the areas you fish....


Let's hear about it....

[storminsteve]

Good point. I have not had any success on the storm shads till the peanuts start the long death march along the beaches. When rainfish are around I don't even bother taking them out.

[hookset]

That also depends on the current. Fish fast moving water and they are less picky.

[finchaser]

I thought some of ya's might like to talk about rubber and how it fits into the fishing you do.....

OK condom man^^^^I've gone through about 40 packs in the last month and a half what do you suggest no profile BS either

I never use shads too expensive I use Rip tide 5" mullet on a lead jig head or Berkley Havoc's mullet on a lead jig head or DOA 5 /2" jerk baits on a jig head

SS you cant beat a 5" pink finesse or zoom fluke in pink when rain fish are present

[DarkSkies]

Condom man???? :2flip: :moon:
Actually I love it....the things you mooks come up with there are some of the most creative in the internet universe....
Don't hold back, keep em coming....:laugh: :clapping:


Fin, I would anwswer your post by saying I don't think I have met an angler so far in my years fishing who could out-fish you in the salt, with rubber.....the subtle things you do....really put you at the head of the rubber class...:ROFLMAO...and your political views and rants and raves put you not too far from the rubber room....:kooky: :kiss:



If any of ya's are fortunate to fish next to the old geezer, take notes...for it's a lucky few who get to do that and see a Master at work....:thumbsup:











******
That being said, we do fish different water...and.... at times.....

these things can matter.....very grateful for your experience and opinions though....:HappyWave:

[porgy75]

Learning so much from this thread. Fin chaser would love to watch you fish one day. Thanks a lot guys!

[storminsteve]

I'm going to save my rubber till these blues are gone. I may give it a try when they thin out but I wouldl rather save money (no offense finchaser and dark) and toss metal or bucktail. You can put grubs on the bucktail. Sometimes I do. The pork rind lasts a lot longer though.

[DarkSkies]

Good responses, all. You cannot expect to be a good surf fisherman without learning how to fish rubber.

This is from a recent post:


I switched to rubber shads and nailed a fish close to legal size. This gave me the motivation I needed. I had been definitely feeling down about my night fishing trips. That activity continued for the next 1 1/2 hours.



15875

15876
Managed 3 bass to 11#.
Released all.
Biggest fish came on a bottle darter, the other fish came on rubber shads. First time for me, that I have gotten fish on shads, since the Spring.



I fish rubber a lot, but the most productive places for me have been in rivers, rips, inlets, or deeper water drop offs...

In addition to the surf zone when small bait is around, and the tsunami eels or small fin-s is the only thing they will hit......

This is my experience only, and others may feel differently. I like the plug bite because of the savage hits you get sometimes. It's very addictive to me and fits my personality. :kooky: :rolleyes:

Rubber is something I tend to rely on heavily when the water is colder, or the fish are closer to the bottom. In those cases it can be a premier presentation, even better than bucktails.....

**Right now, with all the smaller fish, and fish nosing in the sand close to the bottom, rubber should be one of the first things out of your bag...










** One of the best anglers to fish rubber out there is Finchaser. Before we crossed paths, I thought I was pretty decent fishing rubber. Wrong.....When I think of what I learned fishing rubber, much of it is due to his benevolence and patience. For that I am extremely grateful. :HappyWave:

Anyone can fish rubber. Similarly, when the fish are very active it's easy to catch them. What separates that kind of catching, from a slow or scattered bite is the ability of the fisherman.

The subtle nuances, and things you do when fishing, is what often separates a skunk trip from a productive one....and there are few out there who can match the OGB's rubber jigging skills, either in the surf or on a boat......:thumbsup: With rubber, he will often outfish other anglers 3:1...even when they're fishing the same thing....This is a testament to why technique/presentation is so important.....:learn:

[hookset]

Anyone can fish rubber. Similarly, when the fish are very active it's easy to catch them. What separates that kind of catching, from a slow or scattered bite is the ability of the fisherman.

The subtle nuances, and things you do when fishing, is what often separates a skunk trip from a productive one...

True dat. Presentation is everything. The way you fish as well, the way you hold the rod. Some of the bigger shads have 2 eyelets on them, For jigging I use the top eyelet. For a smoother retrieve so it swims on a more even keel i use the eyelet on the front. Definitely makes a difference.

[gjb1969]

well i got some rubber lures now i like the way they look but with the way fishing went for me i have not tryed them still in packs sad but true how many of u guys out there seen or tryed these wave fishing tiki shadick 9 in was at a fishing flea market i took all the vender had he gave me a good deal now i gave a pack to dark so he would be the only guy i know of who has fished them but i dont know how he has done they look like the bass would beat the crap out of them i have a few colors but the one in the pic is purple the are salt covered and have a strong sent i just have not seen many guys useing them it seems odd the shape and and the way it can be fished so if any one wants to try let me know i haev a pack or two i can let go just let us know how u do

[Rip-Plugger]

my rubber box is so damn heavy,it must weigh 4 pounds.
I fish rivers 99% of the time so,i mostly need to get the rubber down.
my rubber of choice is the saltwater assassin sea-shad in 6-10 inch size.I use from a 5/8th oz leadhead to 1-1/2 oz depending on the tides speed.
with the moons influence I have to go heavier to get down deep in some holes I know well.
when I am at a more shallow spot I will throw the 5/8ths head.combined with the rubber it is an ounce or a bit better.

some of these holes are 45 feet deep and some are just 8-15 feet current speed dictates how heavy the head needs to be.
now,I get the heads from bass pro shops,they have a larger hook on the 5/8ths than most,and that size leadhead is hard to find in a bait shop.
I also use the standard shad bodies that I customize with a sharp knife or razor blade.makes them cast farther and smoother,no tumble.

BPS has a shad body that looks just like a baitfish,i forget the name right now but,it is a killer,,,,I have a shot of one,will post it in this post.
the sea-shad has the wobble tail that throbbs when it gets a hint of movement and when holding it in current down low/deep it will get slammed hard by a bass without you doing anything but,holding it.
MK and I have used this tech many times and love doing it.let the water work it for you.

in shallow,I will throw it waay out,let it settle and the line become straight then bring it home slow/steady,they hit it like a jackhammer.
I have also taken fluke at night with it a few times and caught an eel once too.
at this time of year it is what I would throw and let it stay low,bring it home slow.

1589015891
1-sea-shad
2-BPS shad

R-P
:fishing:

[baitstealer]

What about the rubber shads that everyone is catching them on now. Does it matter if the surf water in close is dirty or clean? Thanks in advance.

[Rip-Plugger]

What about the rubber shads that everyone is catching them on now. Does it matter if the surf water in close is dirty or clean? Thanks in advance.

Hi Stealer,

as I said I ffish rivers mostly but,if it is stained or dirty I will use a bright color to attract them,maybe white or bright yellow or even grass green.


R-P

[Monty]

I am a terrible Bucktail Fisherman and not much better at fishing Rubber Shad types of artificials.
Any thoughts at when you would use one of these over the other? Advantages at times of one over the other?
Times they are interchangeable?
I have more confidence fishing the rubber shad types of artificials. Have a better feel of them. And have caught more fish on them than bucktails.
The big drawback for me is BLUES and rubber. The rubber shads get taken off first sign of the yellow eyed demons.

[basshunter]

For a shad I just bring it in as slow as possible. No movement from me because the tail has all the action. When they are there they will whump it!With a bucktail I keep the retrieve steady and try not to get hung up on the bottom. They are fun too because bluefish seem to love them. weakfish too.

[J Barbosa]

I love rubber shads but once the bluefish show up I take them out of the bag to resist the temptation of throwing them.

[DarkSkies]

***

[DarkSkies]

Spring Rubber Tips......


OK thanks to the internet Nazi Ryan F.. :laugh: :HappyWave:..I'm now segmenting this thread into seasons.....
So this is the kick off for the Spring....
Many guys will be using clams or bloodworms the first few weeks, but as the back bay temps climb to 42 and above there will be opportunities to catch early season bass on rubber........

Usually slow and low is a good plan....
At the end of a day where you may have some water warmed by the sun.....







Presentation and where the fish are....

[/B]1. At different times of the season, day, or moon phase, fish will be sitting in different levels of the water column.
2. Your job as a fisherman is to figure out where that is.
3. If you don't present to them where there are sitting you will never know that they are there.
4. In general, (my experience) colder weather, or a cold front, tends to put fish down, where they will sit closer to the bottom.
5. In my experience, this will hold, in general, unless they are feeding actively on bait, at which point they may rise to the surface.
6. There are so many variations for this, that the best thing I can say, is you need to understand the water you are fishing in front of you, and think about moon stage, time of day, current flow (during strong current flow fish at times tend to stay on the bottom or sides where current is less strong), water clarity, water temperature, day vs night time fishing, and some other ones I probably forgot to mention.
7. If you can figure this out, for the place and time you are fishing, it will allow you to work your casts more efficiently.
8. You will only be working on the part of the water column where the fish are most highly concentrated.
9. If you really try to keep disciplined about this, you will see that it will result in more hookups, and more fish.

[DarkSkies]

I'm a little behind in my posting....,meant to put this up earlier....
Summer Rubber Tips......

The most exciting kind of artificial fishing for me....is plugging.....many have different preferences, this is just mine....
There are times in the year, when I protest as I make the shift from plugs., to rubber and bucktails...
But a good fisherman has to adapt, as mentioned above...so I do it....but not without protest....;)

Almost every one of the nicer size legal fish I got this summer, came from rubber being worked slowly...in some cases, rubber won over even the classic methods of fishing bucktails....
This may have been entirely due to the areas where I was fishing, (and your experiences may be different)....

However, there was a point when a few of us noticed that rubber was the only thing that seemed to win out over all other presentations, in the warmer water.......so we rolled with it, persisted, and unless there was a reason to throw big swimmers (like when bunker appeared briefly), we threw rubber and caught some fish that we might otherwise not have known were there.....

[DarkSkies]

Fall Rubber Tips........

So far, for me, it has been a slight continuation of the summer pattern, as the water in some areas is still warm.....

Anyone else want to add anything?


What rubber are you throwing this Fall?
What will you be throwing based on the forage that is moving through your area?

[finchaser]

I throw the same year round no matter what the forage

[DarkSkies]

^^ Yeah, but when they made you they broke the mold......and now that you're older....there's a lotta mold.......:scared: ;) :HappyWave:







The sand eels are finally starting to fill in. The bite is inconsistent....but as the nights go by and the water gets colder the areas where they are setting up will become easier to find............

Sluggos......Eel imitations.,....what rubber are you people having the most success with in the surf? Let's hear about it.....:HappyWave:

[J Barbosa]

Shads are my goto if I want to know if the fish are there...especially bluefish. :viking:

Caught my first 2014 bass on a 4" rubber shad rigged on one of my ball jigs.

[baitstealer]

Shads are my goto if I want to know if the fish are there...especially bluefish. :viking:

Caught my first 2014 bass on a 4" rubber shad rigged on one of my ball jigs.

Question about rubber, because I noticed the guys throwing teasers are trying to match the hatch of small bait out there.
If you are casting rubber, do you try to match the hatch closely like with teasers? If the sandeels do come in does it make sense to throw the big hogys or sluggos for a bigger fish. or do you try to match the bait as closely as possible. thanks

[finchaser]

I never use a teaser with rubber just rubber on a jig head not the premade shads and trust me I catch allot of fish on rubber. I only fish plugs and an occasional teaser if the situation calls for it

Big Hoagies and big Sluggos mimic eels for sand eels DOA jerk bait, storm sand eel (7/8 ounce), vision eel, finesse (4 &5 inch), got striper(5 and 7") and 4" rip tides on 1/2 to 1 ounce bullet style jig heads

For mullet and peanuts I use Lunker City Shakers (6"), AAT's (4") and 5" rip tides on a shad style jig head (jig heads 1/2 to 1/1/2 ounce)

Can't vary depth with the premade they are weighed to size and to get heavier you have to go up in shad size IMO defeats the purpose

Hope this helped you