NC commercial striped bass fishermen can keep 50biggest bass/day, high grading ok!!!

Sent in by G, thanks.
Feel free to comment, or send the letter they have included below to Dr Daniels

Originally circulated by Stripers Forever.

Stripers Forever members - on Jan. 15th the North Carolina, ocean commercial striped bass season opened. In this trawl fishery, individual boats can keep the 50 largest fish that they catch in a day. This practice allows and encourages the culling or high grading of the catch. This means that the boat will keep the 50 largest fish in possession but may continue trawling all day and may replace these fish with larger ones caught later. Replacing means they will throw the dead or dying fish over the side, substituting them with the freshly caught larger bass. It is nearly beyond belief that such a system could be in place, but it is.

Here is the link http://www.examiner.com/fish-and-wil...he-outer-banks to a newspaper story about the debacle. The story itself contains a link to a YouTube video that shows pictures of the dead floating stripers. The trawlers committing this atrocity tow their nets right through fleets of recreational and charter boats that are fishing on the schools. Is it any wonder this resource is becoming scarcer every year?

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SF has sent a letter to Louis Daniels Ph.D. the Director of Marine Fisheries in NC. We hope that you will send the note below or something like it in your own words to Dr. Daniels and let him know that this is a barbaric and unacceptable practice. Here is an e-mail link to his office


louis.daniel@ncmail.net

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Louis Daniels PhD

NC DMF

3441 Arendell Street

PO BOX 769

Morehead City, NC 28557-0769

Dear Dr. Daniels – The world is now aware of the terrible misuse of the striped bass resource caused by the commercial ocean trawl fishery off the North Carolina Outer Banks. These fish are worth considerably more per pound if allocated to the recreational fishery in North Carolina than when taken by commercial harvest. But if the practice of commercial fishing for striped bass must continue in NC, certainly the participants should never be allowed to cull and high grade these fish. It is already too late to save the thousands of large striped bass wasted by this fishery during the 2011 winter season, but we hope that you will use the power of your office to keep this from happening in the future.

Sincerely;

My name here

Dark I went to the link and watched the video. It absolutely disgusted me!
Here is the video, I just copied the letter and will be e-mailing it to Daniels today.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X51MKCrn9RE

This makes me want to puke all these fish will never breed I cannot believe the fisheries management is ok with this here comes the 80's or something worse on top of that they have the idiots illegally fishing the EZ.

WHEN I SAW THIS I GOT SO PO IT MAKES NO SENCE TO ME U KILL ALL THE FISH FOR 50 OF THE BIGGEST AND U CAN KEEP CULLING TO SEE IF U GET EVEAN BIGGER FISH THAT IS A D## SHAME:devil::devil::2flip::beatin::soapbox::lynchm ob:

disgustiing! They are greedy pigs!

I commend the folks who took this video. A lot more awareness needs to be raised. This video is just the thing to show people what is happening down there. I emailed that letter to Dr Daniels, and urge other fishermen to do the same.

Appalling, such a waste it is a crime.

There have to be hundreds of dead fish here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X51MKCrn9RE

money and stupidty

I can't believe that, what a waste of the resource.
I am sending that e-mail this morning. I hope Dr Daniels is listening.

Even with every recreational fisherman obeying the limits, when you see something like this, it doesn't matter what we do. The commercial fishermen kill far more than they catch. They should just let them get their limits, and then they are done. No high grading, that is an absolute tragedy that all those bass become crab food. I just sent that e-mail too, please let us know if there is anything else we can do.

Sickening!

Here is an article they wrote on it,


Yahoo.com
By Jeffrey Weeks - January 19, 2011

- Commercial fishermen trawling off of the Outer Banks of North Carolina are slaughtering thousands of striped bass in 'culling' operations and tossing them overboard trying to keep larger stripers and remain under their 50 fish limit.

Both recreational anglers and smaller operation commercial fishermen have been aghast at the actions of the trawlers who are wiping out massive schools of stripers and discarding smaller fish to stay under the state 50 fish creel but maximize their profits.

A video of the striper carnage has been posted on You Tube showing some of the thousands of floating dead fish left in the wake of the trawlers. Outer Banks fishermen who are witnessing the fish kill have been taking to message boards and calling authorities to protest this striped bass massacre.

'It's an atrocity,' said Captain Aaron Kelly, a top striper guide with over 15 years of experience on the Outer Banks. 'It's gone on before but I think this was the first time it was in front of such a large crowd.'

Captain Kelly said that the day before the video was shot he and the members of his charter followed one trawler for five miles leaving a long wake of dead stripers.

'It's like they have an endless quota,' he said. 'Under the actual numbers are so many dead fish. It's a frightful waste.'

The striper trawling season is not set to close until this Saturday, January 20. The fishery can be closed earlier if a certain quota is reached, but the quota does not count the thousands of dead discards.

Captain JH Miller was on the water the day the video was made and called the scene 'disturbing.'

'I'm not anti-commercial fishing in the least bit, but there is no justification for leaving miles and miles of dead fish out there,' said Captain Miller. 'These were legal-sized fish just thrown away to die.'

Striped bass have to be 28 inches in size to be kept legally, and all of the charter captains confirmed that among the thousands of dead stripers were many that were over 28 inches and in the 15 pound range and higher.

Captain Ray grew up in the area and has fished the Outer Banks for decades.

'It's happened before but this year is the worst I've ever seen it,' said Captain Ray. 'I saw three huge masses of dead stripers from Nags Head to Kitty Hawk. It would be so much simpler if they were allowed a certain amount of pounds and would come in when they caught that many. I have no clue about why they allow this kind of sickening discard.'

Because the trawlers are inside the federal 3 mile limit and not keeping over 50 stripers they may not be technically breaking the law by killing scores of dead fish and throwing them overboard in order to keep netting.

Both Captain Kelly and Captain Ray said the Coast Guard was flying planes and helicopters very low over the area and must have seen the carnage. The Coast Guard has been closely monitoring recreational and smaller commercial fishing boats during the striper season.

Captain Miller said he called the Division of Marine Fisheries hotline for violations yesterday and was told no one was working.

'Even if they are not breaking the law you'd think the Coast Guard could get on for just the pollution like they do the menhaden boats,' said Captain Ray.

The charter captains said that some recreational boats simply gaffed some of the legal stripers and took them aboard to count towards their limits so the fish would not be wasted.

'Commercial fishermen talk about protecting their livelihood all the time,' said Captain Kelly. 'But these big stripers they're throwing out dead, that's their livelihood right there.'

The guys as described below definitely had to be high grading. This law may not be perfect, but it will probably put a stop to most high grading, all right!:clapping::clapping:


Law to change for catching striped bass

Proclamation to be released on Friday

Updated: Friday, 21 Jan 2011, 6:08 AM EST
Published : Thursday, 20 Jan 2011, 5:30 PM ESTMOREHEAD CITY, N.C. (WAVY) - Officials in North Carolina said they plan to change the law for catching striped bass after thousands of dead fish were released into the water over the weekend.
The N.C. Division of Marine Fisheries will replace the current 50-fish-per-day commercial trip limit, which has been in place for 15 years, with a 2,000-pound-per-day limit to avoid the need for fishermen to throw back dead fish.
On Saturday, an overloaded fishing net prompted fishermen on a commercial trawler to release thousands of striped bass they caught off of Bodie Island, officials with the N.C. Department of Environment and Natural Resources said.

After towing through a school of striped bass, fishermen on the commercial trawler Jamie Lynn found the net was so full it was too heavy to bring on the boat. In order to retrieve the net, the fishermen had to open it and release the fish, the boat captain said.

The division is still investigating the incident but has been unable to confirm reports that commercial trawl fishermen were high-grading, or discarding a previously-caught, legal-sized fish in order to keep a larger fish within the daily possession limit.
Commercial fishermen will also be allowed to transfer trip limits to other fishing vessels that hold a striped bass ocean fishing permit for the commercial trawl fishery, but the transfers must be made in the ocean.
The new regulations will be implemented by a proclamation to be released Friday.
The N.C. Marine Fisheries Commission will review these actions at its February 11 meeting in Pine Knoll Shores.

Thanks for posting that, Surferman.

I'm a little puzzled by that video. I have been following that story and the events and outrage that unfolded shortly thereafter. I know they threw those dead bass back. High grading was the probable reason cited. Video is a powerful tool when you want to make a point about something. Look at all the views that video got in a short time, almost 15,000 views in 5 days.

What puzzles me is why they were high grading to the biggest bass. The reason given was the higher value for heavier fish. I accept that.

Yet, in terms of demand value, bringing in a box of 28-34" bass can have more of a universal appeal than a box of 40# bass. Finchaser and others will tell you that for bass and some other species, what end users (people who eat fish) like is dinner plate size fillets. I don't know if that holds true for down South or not.

It's just a minor point, but it puzzles me. What is wrong with the process, IMO, is how they net them.
Even though many hate gill nets, it's been said they are safer for conservation than trawling, which picks up and kills everything in its path. The incident described above, where the net was said to be so heavy the guys couldn't lift it, will still occur with this new law being in place.

It seems to me they lucked into a concentration of bass. They could easily have a "set" of 2000 lbs with one sweep, and then they're done for that short 5 day season. What happens if even with the new law, they start out fresh for the season, and in the first day, get 3500 lbs of bass in one pull? Based on it happening this time, I feel that's a likely possibility in the future.

So they bring the bass in, take the 2000 lbs they're allotted. 1500lbs goes back into the water, dead.
And that, folks, happens frequently in the life of a commercial fisherman. It doesn't happen every day, but it does happen often. I've talked to enough commercial fishermen that I know it's true.

So - the end result is still 1500lbs, or 150 bass, if you figure out an average weight of 10lbs, thrown back dead into the water. Multiply this by all the comm guys fishing for bass down there and you can see the potential dead discards still start to add up. These are all fish that will never get to spawn, and never get to market. Still a black mark on that method of trawling.

And this can happen frequently with comms if they set their nets in the middle of a large mass, like it happens in the winter when the biomass of the entire E Coast is highly concentrated off the coast of NC,

I don't have any answers for this except to suggest that the way these guys net the fish should also be addressd. Call me cynical, but I'm not optimistic that will happen.

For right now, that proposed law is a good one. At least it does address the issue. It will prevent many Capts out there from high grading. I just wanted to lay these thoughts out there so people didn't get a false sense of security and feel the problem is solved.

And again, I don't want to be too pessimistic on this either. Just trying to present all sides of the issue.

I applaud the DMF officials who pushed this forward. :clapping::clapping: There is a lot of lobbying pressure from Commercial fishermen down there. It must not have been easy. In my eyes, at least it's something, and I'm glad to hear of it. :thumbsup:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DarkSkies

I applaud the DMF officials who pushed this forward. :clapping::clapping: There is a lot of lobbying pressure from Commercial fishermen down there. It must not have been easy. In my eyes, at least it's something, and I'm glad to hear of it. :thumbsup:[/INDENT]

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That is a sickening waste of fish. I see what you are saying, ds, but this has been going on for years. They also have the guys on the beach who use the pickup trucks with the nets, I am sure you have all seen that one. Hooray for them finally doing the right thing for once!

It'a about time, good for them.

:clapping::clapping::clapping::clapping::clapping:

The journey of a thousand miles begins with the first step - confucious.

That video made me want to throw up. Good riddance to the netters, burn all their boats for all I care.

Rockhopper and others, I know how ya's feel, it's easy to direct anger at these guys. But let's try to use that anger for a more positive result, which is raising and maintianing awareness of which commercial methods are the worst for the future of fishing. As I understand it, trawling (like they did here) and bottom roller dragging (like they do for fluke and flounder) are 2 of the most destructive forms that exist today.

In a conversation this morning, Finchaser filled me in on some of the points that a lot may not be aware of. I owe him a deep debt of gratitude for his "rants" :HappyWave: and ramblings :rolleyes: that I'm sometimes privy to. He has a perspective that should be shared with many. In many of my postings you may see his influence, albeit toned down a bit. I have to give him a great deal of credit here, although he's a grouchy old basstard. :kiss:


Let me try to summarize some of those points as he explained them:

1. The new regulations are mostly moving forward in a good way.

2. What they prevent-
a. Before, the limit was 50/trip. The incentive was to high grade, because in the fish markets down there, more fish weight equals more dollars. There is no preferential commercial striped bass size, as large bass are filleted and sold to restaurants, some of who market the bass as "grouper", which has more commercial appeal to diners. That's why it made sense to make sure each one of your 50 were as large as possible.

50 bass a day (at 10lbs each) vs 50 bass a day (at 40lbs each) is a difference of 1500lbs.
To simplify this example, if the commercial value of these striped bass wholesale was $3/lb, that would equate to a $1500/day greater paycheck if a comm culled the fish to keep only the largest.

b. Before, that 50/trip limit meant that comm Capts could go out as many times as they wanted. Each trip out of the inlet and back counts as a trip. This is the sneaky distinction that a lot of comms don't want you to know about. So it's conceivable that one comm boat could catch 200 bass/day (4 trips)

c. Now, that limit is changed to 2000 lbs/DAY. They go and throw the set, and as soon as they have 2000lbs on board (must meet legal minimum size) they're done for the day.

d. They are actually allowed to catch more at one time NOW than they were previously. People need to be aware of that distinction. However, at least with things this way, there will be less high-grading or culling. This type of regulation is more geared toward long term sustainibility because it produces less dead discards.

e. Although people are cheering about this, there is also the possibility of corruption. There have always been Capts who will disregard the law, and sometimes improper relationships between a small % of fishermen and those who are charged with enforcing the law. Hopefully, with this new regulation, those minor numbers of incidents will happen less frequently.

You all need to be aware that there are now lobbyists for the commercial fishing industry registering on the fishing websites. Some of them are very persuasive. I feel their logic is flawed and try to debate their manipulation every chance I get. I and some others spent hours yesterday debating with one such lobbyist.

I want you folks to be able to recognize the pattern of some of these arguments in case you run across them. Don't merely wish violence upon comms, don't merely hold on to your anger....but please DO educate yourselves so you know what to say if you get sucked into one of these debates asking for "parity" for the Comm sector.


The pattern of the argument is this:
(Currently this form of argument is being used to get fisheries management to open NJ to Commercial striped bass fishing.)

1. Comm fisherman have been beaten up for too long, and the stringent regulations have been too heavily on their backs.

2. Comms are not killing most of the bass. The Recs are. (to some extent I agree with this, and there are threads on this site that go into more detail why).
But...I am in complete disagreement with any further advancement of this premise.
The lobbyists I mentioned skew the facts and manipulate the truth so their side's apathy for the longevity of a growing biomass is obscured.

3. Because of the Magnusson Stevens Act, many comms are demanding parity with rec anglers and say they have the right to catch striped bass the same as rec anglers do (It's a little more involved than this, folks, I'm just trying for a simple outline here)

4. They are manipulating and grandstanding, saying they represent all those in America who cannot fish but want to eat fish. They claim the fishing rights for those people should be represented by the Comms, and therefore they should be allowed to fish for striped bass everywhere, including the EEZ.

5. They are claiming that their mortality rate is far less than the rec mortality rate, and as such this "unfairness" should be addressed.
(The problem with this argument is that the figures represent when they have an observer on board - the mortality of fish brought in by trawler or bottom dragger is far greater when the observers are not on board, or in many other instances, such as high-grading, keeping prohibited species, etc. )

6. They are also "ashamed" :ROFLMAO that when they catch other species of fish, that they are "forced" by "idiot gov't regulations" to throw back dead striped bass. The gov't should just allow them to keep "a reasonable amount" of those dead bass discards, they claim, since they are dead anyway.

7. To bring things back to "parity", they argue they should be allowed to fish for striped bass in every state where it is currently prohibited. This is the only fair choice, they argue.




If you ever run across arguments like the above one, please try not to attack the ones who advance them. Instead, try to poke holes in their logic, respectfully and assertively. :moon:

Ignoring them won't help.
Engaging them to show others of their flawed logic....will.

This thing about them getting striped bass quota won't go away, folks. Every year at the marine fisheries hearings they bring this subject up and ask for consideration. So, merely getting angry at them solves nothing.

They are as persistent as those in the Pew Trust. Like those in the Pew Trust, we must learn not to ignore them or their agendas. Instead, those who care about the future of the resource should educate themselves and be willing to face them in any debate that arises.





Of course, there are those on those site and others who don't give a crap about this stuff and other fishing issues...:don't know why: they only want to fish :fishing: and can't be bothered.

That's fine, no one is forcing you to care.

But please remember these words....the Pew Trust and Commercial fishing lobbying groups like the ones I described above....

are counting on your apathy. :2flip:


Thanks for reading, people.
All comments welcome. :thumbsup:

from a email that I recieved:

Stripers Forever Members – never question the value of e-mailing or otherwise communicating your comments to politicians and/or fishery managers. Dr. Louis Daniel called me from NC last Wednesday evening and told me he had received an unprecedented amount of comment from our members on the dead striped bass high graded by commercial trawlers last week off the Outer Banks. To Dr. Daniel’s credit he has changed this regulation to one that does not allow the practice of high grading. It is a positive step for the striped bass. Dr. Daniel was very gracious in our conversation, and we should remember that he inherited the regulations already in place in NC, a state with a history of total commercial dominanation of the fishery management process. I believe that the input of our members affected this change just as I think we were an important voice in motivating the ASMFC to vote against the commercial quota increase two months ago.


We must end the commercial exploitation of striped bass. Nothing short of that will ever solve these problems. For those that would say it is more important that we work on forage issues, I would respond that forage fish are vital, but after 40 years of crying about the over harvest of shad, herring, eels, menhaden, sand eels, and the like, that we have gotten almost nowhere. Envision striped bass as a coast wide game fish, managed for a much higher level of abundance, and the incredible guiding, tackle, and tourism angling businesses that would be generated. Then we'd then have the clout to demand the reduction of or the end to the plunder of the prey species needed to feed these fish. Until now we've gone with hat in hand and we've come out with nothing. That is the wrong approach.


Thanks to the dedicated efforts of our MA board, with the help of one of the state’s top lobbyists working for a small fraction of his normal fee, we have filed three striped bass conservation bills in the state legislature this session. Help us get them passed, and we will have done something of enormous value for the generations of saltwater anglers to come.


Make It A Game Fish!
Brad Burns, President of Stripers Forever

Quote:

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Originally Posted by DarkSkies

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But please remember these words....the Pew Trust and Commercial fishing lobbying groups like the ones I described above....

are counting on your apathy. :2flip:


Thanks for reading, people.
All comments welcome. :thumbsup:

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Absolutely, it won't be long before the rants about the netters and the commercial catches start. what about the long island capts fishing over the line?